Wilf Rosenberg

Quote: Juan Cornetto "Why do you choose to make things personal? Why would I like it to be in any theatre? '"

I don't. I'm debating the subjects.

You said the Typhoon isn't in theatre yet (which it is in the roles I identified) so I simply asked which theatres it has missed that you think it should have made since it came into service with the RAF?

Quote: Juan Cornetto "My point is that this aircraft has suffered from massive delays in production, major technical problems to such an extent that it has not been deployed in any of the wars we are, and have been, engaged in. There are still doubts about its reliability and futher doubts about its future role as it is now not up with the best in class.'"

So name the wars it has been held back from and the roles it should have been fulfilling in them.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "
What is it with you? When you are confronted with facts that question your one-eyed viewpoint you either disagree but fail to say why (even when asked several times) or you come up with spurious comments like these.'"

'Facts' like the Typhoon isn't a supercruising aircraft or the RAF have difficulty getting it flying off the ground. Those sort of facts?

Quote: Juan Cornetto "We have been discussing the pros and cons of a particular aircraft and not the RAF. In doing so I have made comparisons which show the F22 to be the better aircraft so these are not "ridiculous irrelevant comparisons" '"

It's irrelevant to this discussion because the F22 is not now and probably never will be in the future part of the RAF's inventory nor will it likely fall into the hands of an aggressor.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "With regard to my comment about "they have enough problems getting them off the ground let alone an aircraft carrier" you know full well this was in the context with my points about the many technical problems that have been keeping the Typhoo out of service and nothing to do with the RAF. '"

It's in service. I see them flying in service every working day and have done for at least 3 years, probably longer. Where's your evidence that it isn't in service?

Quote: Juan Cornetto "May I remind you my son in-law is a front line Tornado pilot so do not dare suggest I have anything but the highest regard for him and his brave colleagues. The RAF deserve the best equipment and to say the Typhoon is not the best is a statement of fact and in no way undermines the reputation of the RAF. My whole point is that politicians, designers and manufacturers have let down the RAF!'"

Stating that the RAF are unable to fly one off the ground would suggests otherwise.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "For someone who is always quoting stats it appears you only like to use the ones that suit your own prejudice. 64 operational RAF Typhoons were grounded and priority checks were made on the quick reaction force and those stationed in the Falklands. All the Typhoons aircraft in Germany, Spain, Italy, Austria and Saudi Arabia were been taken out of service.'"

Taken out of service? More over-dramatisation, how is this furthering the discussion?

The article you posted was a minor issue concerning the Martin Baker Mk16A ejector seat. I don't believe it was an issue for the RAF Typhoons as such as the correct procedures for arming the seat were carried out through adherence to the manual (perhaps the Saudis should have come to Britain rather than go to Spain) the temporary cessation of training flights was only a procedural matter. The ban (which never effected operational flights) came in on the Wednesday for the training flights and was lifted five days later once all the paperwork was filed 3 working days later.

Your evidence of a serious problem with the Typhoon fell at the first hurdle and the Austrians agreeto discontinue exercise and training flights of the Eurofighter because of a perceived safety problem in the ejection seat.

This is a normal procedure to ensure safety.

The interruption was necessary because, if mishandled, the parachute could become separated from the ejection seat in case of ejection.

Pilots are being trained in the new procedures. Thereafter, the training and exercise operations are resumed.

This measure has no effect on the supervision and monitoring of air space.

Eurofighter will continue to carry out operational missions - so-called A-priority flights - and remains fully operational.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "No. Do you? '"

Yet you just did.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "They can both fly as low but the Harrier is no where near as fast or can take as large a payload, which is why the GR4 is the low level fast ground attack aircraft of choice for both the RAF & NATO.'"

And a capable platform it is too but without the flexibility of the Harrier. What size of aircraft package would it take for a Tornado to drop a bomb on the Falklands or to provide close air support to the troops on the ground should the Argentinians fancy taking the island again?

From the in house Conservative newspaper

What they are doing to the armed forces under the heading Strategic is anything but and while I expect no-one to listen to my concerns perhaps they should listen to those expressed by Dr Liam Fox - the coalition's defence secretary

Personal attack after personal attack but unlike you I'll just stick to the subject which is far more important if that's alright with you.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "You have no idea who I am a fan of so do not presume. It is certainly no surprise that you predict the doom and gloom of a Labour loser. I don't recall you predicting the mess that they have left us all in!'"

You quoted the IFS on page 7 of this thread.

How we got here is interesting but not as interesting as how we go forward from here.

Quote: Juan Cornetto "In a recent biography of Gordon Brown it appears that his inability to ever apologise or admit he was wrong stems back to his upbringing at the manse by his over strict father. That explains his troubled personality defects. What is your excuse?'"

Is there any need, really?