Fair enough, I'm sure Kirke will feature at Wembley, because he's clearly in McD's clique. I just find it frustrating watching him. He's a unit, a massive bloke, but has no heart for collision or impact. He could tear it up if he really wanted to, would love to see that.

I thought his effort with ball in hand was improved against Cas. More drives and most of them were actually drives.

Gentle Giant though. That aggression you just can't teach. You've got it or you ain't.

I don't know.

If we caged him for a few weeks, prodded him with a sharp stick and fed him raw meat, i think he'd come out pretty aggressive.

Kirke had a good game, Hauraki was terrible in defence again

Which is why he shouldn't be playing SL! I've spent 7 years waiting for him to get mad and show us what he can really do, but it ain't gonna happen for that simple reason - he's a nice guy.

Couldn't see him getting a look in at Wigan, Saints or Wire

In the salary cap environment all teams have their share of plodders to be fair

have you ever seen Todd Flanders getting mean?

Funnily enough I was watching Family Guy last week, the episode where Quagmire has an affair with Loretta. Eventually the usually laid back Cleveland snaps and gives it large. Please can someone have an affair with Kirkes missus. Preferably around Aug26th

I thought he was alright yesterday, knock-on a part. Some fairly aggressive carries.

I thought Bailey and Delaney were our best forwards, Bailey was awesome.

Highlight was when Chase tried putting a shot on Bailey and Bailey just swatted him away! Haha!

Why the insistence in defending his inclusion ? What you say is true but Kirke is not just a fringe player...somehow he makes the 17 every damn week. Ali, despite his relative decline, would be the better bench choice. Pitts too.

No doubt he will also frustratingly make the 17 next season regardless of any new signing (s) and the return of the better Ambler plus Amor.

I asked the same question on another thread because I can't think of any occasion where Leeds have beaten Wigan in a Final.

The only Finals I can remember are...

1982/83 - John Player Special Trophy Final at Elland Rd - Wigan 15 Leeds 4
1993/94 - Challenge Cup Final at Wembley - Wigan 26 Leeds 16
1994/95 - Challenge Cup Final at Wembley - Wigan 30 Leeds 10
1994/95 - Premiership Trophy Final at Old Trafford - Wigan 69 Leeds 12
1998 - Super League Grand Final at Old Trafford - Wigan 10 Leeds 4

We can also exclude Championship Finals and Floodlit Trophy as well.

Shame he didn't do the same on another much smaller bloke in the CC Final last year when a simple try was begging.

I've nothing to add to that at the moment. I don't have a definitive list and I don't like to go out on a limb but I'm thinking Leeds have never beaten Wigan in a 1st grade Final. At Academy level perhaps but not at 1st grade.

Anderson?