Here is a question from our board that most on here should be able to answer;

When TS joined you in 2004 would you say that he recruited a team in, or did he mainly draw on the existing talent and juniors coming through in order to win the silverware ? Obviously he did bring some players into the squad and I remember he was interested in others e.g. Ellis at the the time, but where would you say was the balance ?

From memory, the new recruits for Smith's first season in 2004 were Marcus Bai, Ali Lauitiiti and Chris McKenna.

Think Carl Ablett and Nick Scruton might have made their first team debuts that year as well?

Gareth Ellis then came in 2005, so it's a bit of both really

McKenna played in 2003. Bai was announced before Smith came in. Apart from that you're spot on. THe team was there, it just got adjusted as time went by

Scruton made his debut before Smith came. Away at Wigan I think. Not sure Ablett made his debut in 2004 though.

As for Smith he worked with what he had, which to be honest any decent coach could have taken to the title in 2004. But then he added and improved which took us to further levels.

It's always difficult to say with Leeds as Hetherington has such a big role in the recruitment of players alongside the head coach.
IIRC under Smith we recruited:
Lauitiiti
Ellis
Donald
Kirke
McAvoy
Millard
O'Neill
Peacock
Thackray
Toopi
Webb

And the likes of Ablett, JJB, Smith, Tansey & Scruton came through.

IMO the difference between the 2003 side, and the 2004 was massive despite it being pretty much the same side. More clinical in attack, and tighter in defence. Whether, this was just a result of good timing as the young players in the team matured I'm not sure, but for the first couple of years of reign we were a superb side and a joy to watch.
It went downhill for the next 18 months as we lost a number of players, and the likes of Calderwood, Mathers, McKenna, Furner, Adamson, Dunemann, Ward, Thackray, Bai, Walker, McDermott all left the club by the end of 2006, and Matt Diskin never quite managed to reproduce his 2004 form so we struggled. Smith deserves real credit for rebuilding the side during that time.

Regarding Warrington, he's been superb for them as well, but he's definitely been there a couple of seasons too long IMO.

Make your own mind up......

BEFORE SMITH
DURING SMITH
AFTER SMITH

Full Backs

Brent Webb v Salford 11.02.07
Gary Connolly v Castleford 26.12.01
Jordan Tansey v Catalan Dragons 15.09.06
Lee Smith v Wakefield 28.03.05
Richie Mathers v St Helens 00.00.03

Wingers

Ben Jones Bishop v Celtic Crusaders 18.04.08
Francis Cummins v Hull KR 19.09.93
Marcus Bai v London 22.02.04
Mark Calderwood v ??? 00.00.01
Ryan Hall v Bradford 06.05.07
Scott Donald v Huddersfield 11.02.06

Centres

Brett Delaney v Crusaders RL 29.01.10
Chev Walker v Halifax 13.08.99
Clinton Toopi v Hull FC 04.08.06
Kallum Watkins v Celtic Crusaders 18.04.08
Keith Senior v London Broncos 10.09.99

Halves

Danny McGuire v Salford 06.07.01
Kevin Sinfield MBE v Sheffield Eagles 22.08.97
Rob Burrow v Hull 06.04.01

Prop Forwards

Barrie McDermott v Bradford 22.09.95
Chris Feather v ??? 00.00.03
David Furner v Castleford 26.12.02
Danny Ward v Sheffield Eagles 02.07.99
Ian Kirke v Castleford 05.03.06
Jamie Peacock MBE v Huddersfield 12.02.06
Jamie Thackray v Hull FC 04.08.06
Kylie Leuluai v Salford 11.02.07
Luke Burgess v Castleford 07.03.08
Mark O'Neill v Wakefield 26.12.05
Nick Scruton v ??? 00.00.02
Ryan Bailey v Wakefield 28.06.02

Hookers

Andrew Dunemann v ??? 00.00.03
Danny Buderus v Wakefield Wildcats 13.02.09
Matt Diskin v Castleford 24.02.01
Shane Millard v Huddersfield 10.02.06

Second Rowers

Ali Lauitiiti v Salford 28.05.04
Carl Ablett v London Broncos 18.07.04
Gareth Ellis v Castleford 26.12.04
Jamie Jones-Buchanan v Wakefield 07.05.99
Matt Adamson v Castleford 26.12.01
Willie Poching v Castleford 26.12.02

Essentially,Smith took a squad which already had the main ingridients to be a success and turned it into winners.There was never a need for major overhaul when he was here,just a sprinkling of quality which most players were who came during his tenure.Similar to what he did at Warrington with the string of CC's and top league finishes.I am a little surprised he hasn't been able to achieve the SL title yet with Wire in that time but he's got damn close just not had the little bit of luck to get the job done.

Thanks for the in depth analysis, appreciated.

For my money still the best coach in the league by some distance.

Whilst I can see your point, I think that he has underperformed at Warrington where he had the opportunity to put them at the top of the RL tree. Despite beating Leeds tice this season and being the only team that leeds have not looked like matching, they are still 7 pointe behind having only won 5 of their other 12 games.

My personal opinion is that he has gone as far as he can go with Warrington and both he and they need a fresh impetus

That's a very good point and one I agree with. If any year was to be Warrington's, it was 2011 in my opinion until you lot turned them over in the final play-off round. You may have won the overall comp, and played the play-offs brilliant, but they were the best team in the league that year.

If you don't think Smith is the best coach in the league, then who is?

My bias may come into it, but I think Wane has to be up there. Turned some average players into one's looking way above their 'perceived' level. I also like McDermott, and his record speaks for itself, but a few of you aren't so keen?

At present there is no team that is performing well. Last season I would have put Powell in the mix, at the moment I don't know, all have their positives but I think all could be questioned on their coaching skills. Wane seems to be a shouter /bully which can have positive effects in the short term but can be detrimental in the long term and I think Wigan are on the edge of that cycle.

Cunningham is looking ok, but a bit raw and Saints results have shown this. I wouldn't put any coach a being better at the moment, the question is more of which coaches have peaked and are now on a downward spiral and which ones can reinvent themselves to produce momentum.

Comparing Smith's Leeds spell with his Warrington spell is tricky with regards to the team that was built during his time.

Hetherington will have played a significant part in the recruitment and we probably would've signed most of the players we did regardless of who was the coach. At Wire I believe he has pretty much full say on who joins and Simon Moran simply deals with the cheque book side of things.

I would say If you tried forming a combined team of academy graduates who played a significant amount of games and became REGULARS during HIS TIME there then it wouldn't make that impressive a reading and he's had 10 years combined at two very big clubs.

If you made a combined team of signings made during his time there then it would look very impressive but how much is that down to Hetherington's infulence at Leeds and Moran's chequebook at Warrington?

What will be interesting to see at Warrington is how they cope now with the immediate departure of Higham to Leigh. During his time at Warrington, their strength over over top teams has consistently been having two top hookers. Higham and Monaghan, and now Clark with the former until his departure this week. Clark no doubt obviously a great player but hasn't quite hit the notes there and if he was to get injured then they're really screwed and it impacts the performance of some other key players for them like Hill and Westwood by the lost at hooker they've experienced.

Smith is massive on the technical side for sure but where he really turned Leeds around was on the psychological side - Leeds was a losing club with a losing mentality and he made them winners. That is the difference between a good coach and a great one.