Thank you for a well formed contra argument.

2011 was a massive year in all respect, McD came in to a successful club and had to put his stamp on the team. Yes we had great players, but they all kept resigning extensions to play under him. I think the league form was likely down to players being uncomfortable with his coaching style. Name players that have left during his tenure that have been successful under other coaches?

In 2014, we were joint 2nd until round 21 then fell apart in the league after the cc win. I suspect the players mentally were done after that and I think that was disappointing. Both players and coach accept that as mentioned in the AGAIG documentary. Fast forward a year, almost replicating the same downfall. We have the experience to complete the treble.

2016 was a perfect storm and we were awful, but I don’t believe McD told the players to go out there and play crap, he managed to turn it around when it mattered and when we got our training facilities back.

I loved the Doug Laughton era, that was when I was a young kid and fell in love with the game.

I agree standards have fallen but that’s not leeds’ fault. The game needs some serious investment to get it back to the peak SL era which I think was when Tony Smith was in charge. Some of the rugby we played then was amazing to watch. Where that investment comes from will be interesting and hope the new RFL chief can help it get back to that.

But as a club, we seem to be doing alright despite this. I’ll be a fan if we get to old Trafford, I’ll be a fan if we get relegated to the championship.

I think you'll find that was Jon Wilkin and he was saying it as a compliment as they had just been beaten by Leeds.

And when it works it looks great. Unfortunately when it doesn't, we don't have anything decisive in our locker to fall back on.

Players stood still receiving the ball, players making 30 yards sideways, no dummy runners, same turgid predictable last tackle options (Moons hoof, Mylers kick for touch, tackled with ball in hand 10 meters out) We just don't have anyone in our team able / prepared to take the squad by the scruff of the neck during a game and lead them. Shut down Myler, shut down Leeds.

Yes Wilkin was one but I think the other was Kev Brown and I seem to think a Cas player but cannot be certain.
Not sure it is that much of a compliment mate if our own players don`t know what we are doing.
Must be a n easy gig as coach at the Rhinos if the message is "just do your own thing and baffle the opposition"

Given our results this year it doesn't seem like anyone's having any difficulty with our 'unpredictable' play, and neither did they in 2016. I think the whole unstructured thing is overplayed - we did have structure in 2015, in the GF we played a very controlled game. Ditto earlier wins, and even last year. A game based around offloads ccan still be structured, and in fact only works if everyone knows what's intended and reacts accordingly.

'Unstructured' is often used as cover for poor play. The most entertaining sides in the game have thrown the ball around a lot but with some semblance of a plan. When you see a side with players bunched in the middle for multiple tackles in a set, no movement by players without the ball to create space, and one man rugby for 4 out of 5 tackles, you aren't watching unstructured, you're watching rubbish. Hand on heart I think Leeds have been terrible to watch most of this year, all of 2016 and a lot of last year as well.

I’d second you.

The standard of play from us has been terrible this year, we haven’t had one game where we’ve played a full 80. We’ve got by with 20/30 min bursts before these injuries have forced out players.