Quote: Andy Gilder "That's exactly what I am saying.
If the ball carrying arm hits the ground while the player is being touched by a defender, he cannot then make a second movement to reposition the ball.
The player can continue to slide towards the line due to momentum, but he can't pick the arm up and promote the ball while doing so.
Had Charnley dropped off Hall before the ball carrying arm hits the ground, then the tackle would not have been complete and he would have been free to play on. Had he dropped off after the ball carrying arm hits the ground, the tackle is complete and Hall would have had to play the ball.
In the scenarios you have described, I can only think the referee has adjudged that the player did not make a second movement. Sometimes if a player is rolling or bounces off the floor after being tackled they can get away with making a slight second movement with the arm and get the benefit of the doubt.
I suspect that's what Ian Smith did on Sunday, but IMO he was wrong to do so. It wasn't Carvell's momentum that enabled him to get the ball down. The tackle was complete even though he was still moving, and he made a distinct second movement with the arms to get the ball down.'"
But that’s not a double movement. A double movement is to move after the tackle is complete, whilst the tackle is the process of being completed the player is free to do whatever he wants, he hasn’t been tackled. If Hall wasn’t tackled he is free to put the ball down. If the tackle is complete he isn’t able to put the ball down and isn’t able to be pulled in to touch.
The tackle isn’t complete when a players ball carrying arm hits the floor, we know this because you have described situations where Charnley can fall off the tackle or Hall could slide. The Tackle is complete when the ball carrying arm hits the deck, and the momentum of the player stops.
The rules state
If a tackled player, because of his momentum slides along the ground, the tackle is deemed to have been effected where his slide ends.
It would be a nonsense to say that a tackle is completed where the momentum ends and not when the elbow hits the floor, but the tackle is complete when the elbow hits the floor and not when momentum ends.