Hi everyone,

- ThePrinter - I agree, I don't think we can be saving ourselves for the second part of the season either, surely we can't be choosing to play badly! I think it's far too early for us to be thinking about next year (though I'm sure the Club are), but again I agree with you that if things remain as they are, it will become too tiring to be winning the league from 5th or below. In terms of this year, obviously 9th is well below par but if we win our game in hand next Monday we will go up to 8th and will only be 2 points below Saints in 4th. It's important not to forget as well that we've played most of our games to date away from home, and we've already played Wire, Wigan and Saints twice. I understand people looking towards Mac for an answer but like I say I really believe that it's desperation which is causing these performances, and I think only the players can choose to let go of this and crack on. The problem is that you can't just drop half the team because then you're not giving anyone a fair chance at winning the next game - not the young players coming through, nor the players you keep. I also think he's right to keep faith in some of the senior players who could click at any time.

- tvoc - I've been waiting for someone to mention London!! London was a completely different situation to what we have at Leeds; guys don't play for London because they want to play there, they play for London because they want to play rugby, the loyalty is just not the same. Nor did they have the salary cap budget that we have (that is not the case this year). The league standings alone do not tell the story of that particular season, and where I have cited previous standings I have tried to tell a bit more of a story of that season.

To be honest its nice to have a positive poster on here. I'm kind of split on the subject though, i think while McDermott needs to be questioned for the performance (opposite to what the OP thinks) i agree with him that the criticism shouldn't go into abuse territory. Healthy and non-too-personal criticism is ok, going onto booing during games, name calling and disrespectful comments i think is unnecessary.

I believe Swiftcorn got a bit of a ban following an argument on the VT with an Aussie about Aussie Rules Football and claiming he knew Australia better than a guy who lives there. Don't know if it applies to here though but his absence is greatly appreciated.

Quote: Gotcha "Come on folks. This is another AP/Keith alias. Don't get sucked in.'" It's not really a case of getting sucked in, as others have commented it's remained a civil discussion. I've always been notoriously poor at identifying the men behind the 'characters' but agree it's likely to be one of the regulars. Either way it's provided an outlet for some frustration. Will it change anyone's view - I doubt it. rhinowinorlose probably still thinks Henry Paul wasn't replaced at the Harlequins and that he was always a leading role model off the field : news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... 038590.stm I'm guessing the Quins were just grateful he wasn't the chauffeur driver behind the wheel of that Mercedes S280.

Quote: Gotcha "Come on folks. This is another AP/Keith alias. Don't get sucked in.'" It's not really a case of getting sucked in, as others have commented it's remained a civil discussion. I've always been notoriously poor at identifying the men behind the 'characters' but agree it's likely to be one of the regulars. Either way it's provided an outlet for some frustration. Will it change anyone's view - I doubt it. rhinowinorlose probably still thinks Henry Paul wasn't replaced at the Harlequins and that he was always a leading role model off the field : news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... 038590.stm I'm guessing the Quins were just grateful he wasn't the chauffeur driver behind the wheel of that Mercedes S280.

Agreed. It's a discussion forum, this is a discussion. Does seem to wind a few people up though - not sure why.

I think in short they players have to take the criticism for the way they play and they shouldn't be exempt from criticism but equally the manager has to take some blame for the standard of play and tactics used in the game.