....which I've said since the day he started. However today our first 65 mins of one man rugby were awful against a team that was better than us. The last 15 mins we looked like we could score.

We've put the ball down Hardmans throat all night...he doesn't drop those. They've challenged us with every kick.

We can forget about Sheffield/Fev now. We need to hang on to third. We also need to mix up the safety (not tonight) of the first 65 mins with the excitement of the last 15 mins in the big games. We are the 3rd best team in the competition this year. Batley (not Leigh) may yet look like making us the fourth best team. We are where we deserve to be.

Form for the play offs please Fax. Come on you blues....

I have to question our coaching after tonight as we do not seem able to pass the ball, why? We also do not have a game plan that actually uses dummy halves and dummy runners we just have this one man smash 'em boring rugby stuff, only when we have either already lost a game like tonight or are well on top do we start to play some decent rugby. So while I like Karl he is Fax through and through I have to wonder about his tactics as just trying to smash a team like Fev don't work, it don't work against lots of teams come to think of it!
Also why do we never put pressure on the kicker like Finn? Fev did tonight all the game, why don't we?
I agree we are 3rd at best this year we have been well beat by the top 2 and that tells you a story, as for a Grand Final forget it.

Not big enough, not fast enough and not strong enough.

We are what Batley used to be under Karl, ok against other mid table teams but against top teams we come up short time after time, 4th in the table.

Operationally, commercially and from a club perspective Karl has taken us forward massively. Sadly I'm not and have never been convinced about his coaching qualities. He's very one dimensional and has never really been able to take any club to the level Powell did at Fev. He's improved every club he went to for a period of time but seems to reach his Plato and then that's it. On the pitch I seriously don't see any improvement from last year and feel like we've lost momentum slightly.

I understand this is Karl's dream job and he is Halifax through and through but I've said before what we need is fresh ideas from somebody not connected with Halifax RLFC who can help us push on... Controversial and I'm not saying we should sack Karl but anyone who knows me will tell you that I've always said I wasn't sure Rhino was the answer to all our prayers and the rugby this last two years has been pretty boring sometimes painfully so to watch.

An new assistant coach with half-back experience an option?

I have to question the player mentality last night. Straight from kick off we weren't ready. We weren't fired up. Too slow to react to Finn straight from the word go. Their players were sledging and back slapping straight from the word go. Ours were looking at each other saying "this is your ball" and then letting it bounce. THEY DID THIS TWICE IN A ROW FROM A FINN KICK OFF.

Midway through the first half Rob fielded what looked to me like a lame kick but he made a meal of it because his reactions weren't sharp enough. He doesn't get enough game time - keeps drifting in and out of the team so he isn't match sharp.

Sometimes we turn up with the wrong attitude and it seems only Murrell can instil a sense of urgency into the squad - I think one day he'll make a great coach.

Are we much different a club from Featherstone and Sheffield that we can't achieve the consistency that they do? What is the common denominator? Is it the coaching? Powell and Aston are good coaches - there's no argument there but last night there was no Powell. What makes these teams tick?

Is the common denominator the way we handle our playing staff as a club? Do we operate the correct strategy as regards contracts, bonus structures and player management? Who knows? Something doesn't quite gel with our squads. We've won trophies though and our club hasn't run into financial calamities like Leigh for example. However, we're just not quite the finished article. I have no clue how the team are going to perform on a weekly basis. One week world beaters, next week headless chickens. It's been like that for ten years. Luckily for me it doesn't curb my enthusiasm to be a Fax fan.

I have to question some of our players level of fitness too. They looked sharper then us, they had big units but they were fit big units.

To be honest at the end of the day think Fev just have better players, Kain, Kaye, Ellis, Finn, that's 4 top quality halfbacks right there.

Some of the same problems from last season and then a few obvious recruitment mistakes this season coming back to haunt us. Half backs and hooker, not much point saying anything else because its obvious to anyone with half a brain that is where the majority of our problems lie and is probably the reason we will have new half backs and a hooker next season although I do feel it has come a year too late in the sense that it was obvious last season we had a problem at half.

I didnt think Fev were that much better than us but we make a lot of basic mistakes but thats just not happened under KH its been going on a number of years now. Obviously mistakes happen but I talking more about pretty fundamental mistakes like twice not collecting a kick off, once is maybe at a push excusable but to then have Finn kick the ball in the same place and us not be set up ready for it isnt.

We were just really poor again in a big game theres not much more you can say and the game was pretty much over after about 15 minutes.

Well see how Finn goes with us next season eh??

agree, i think we all knew we would struggle without murrell. but it showed up even more the lack of hooker and halfback, thackery tried his heart out but could not do it alone.

Two year contract?

Whichever we get out of Ridyard or Finn I think we can safely say that our kicking game is going to be better than this years when we have played without Murrell.

It does mean we will have to get a pretty quick half back to partner those though. Quick and good though not just quick.

I hear and it is purely rumour at this stage our halves will be Ridyard and Finn. Ridyard allowed to leave final year of contract if we allow Barlow to do the same so he can honour the 2 yr deal offered by Leigh and vice versa???

Ok , we were very average with early mistakes that just gave fev points and confidence. Once again we were out-muscled up front and out-thought at half back. Howver if you give any team in the top 5 that start you not likely to win.

As for fitness i thought we coped as well as expected after such a stint of defending. We coughed up too much ball , but mainly due the Fevs smart plays. I can read our game plan though and if i can other teams ball boys could.

Riddy ? Anyone who believes that believes in Father Christmas.