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no point bothering wasting cash on this. save it for 2015 instead.

its clear widnes will be given the lisence due to the wonderful input they have given to rugby league in recent times

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I've tried to have an open mind when it comes to Super League, franchising/licencing but I just can't.

Please don't take my comments around your season being mediocre out of context. Opinions are of course subjective. Our own season without the grand final win could be described as mediocre after all.

I think any business which overstretches itself and takes unnecessary risks is being foolish in the extreme.

But.....I refer you to my earlier comments about what sport is all about. Sport is not a balance sheet, sport is not a balanced scorecard, sport is not a SWOT analysis, sport is not about accepting second best.

Sport is about dreams, reaching higher heights, jumping further, running faster, being better. I refer you to my good friend Captain Sensible - 'If you don't have a dream, how you gonna make a dream come true.'

How did you feel in 1989? Pretty good I imagine! We did beat you in the first game of the season though. Doug Laughton liked our sliding defence and made it work for him. Didn't work for us and we got relegated. Brilliant team you had, can't imagine that team was fiscally sound. Jonathon Davies can't have been cheap. World Club champions too beating Canberra I recall. I'd love to see the balance sheet for that season.

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Quote: J20 "You need to look at it with a more open mind as well though, In total honesty I agree with the principles of franchising but I just don’t agree with the way the RFL are going about it and like other things, how quickly they implemented it without thinking it through.

You say it’s no better for the international game BUT would Widnes have invested as much in the academy if was P&R? Would Fev and Halifax now be talking seriously about doing so? No they wouldn’t. This stuff doesn’t change overnight! Would Widnes be running on a sound business plan now? Unlikely.

You guy’s were on here saying if you didn’t win this 100k it would be financial suicide (like we saw going for broke in 2007) yet now your saying your ‘plan’ is the best way to do things?

You go on about accepting mediocrity (one I don’t agree are squad start of the year was very strong on paper at least) but two, one of your posters said they’d feel cheated as a Widnes fan… BUT… Who cheated us more?


The board who spent more then the CLUB could afford to have a winning side on the park reaching Grand Finals yet then when it didn’t pay off on what is really an 80m lottery my club ended up in administration and (though highly unlikely) in a position where I may not have had a club anymore.

Or…

The board who got a grip of the finances, plugged a few leaks and started looking for some strong partnerships with other business. Still spent up to full cap but didn’t try and work around it pumping thousands in the first team for again something that may not guarantee SL at the end of the season? A board that has secured the long term future of my rugby club and is investing massively into the hot bed of local youth in the region? A club that wins awards as does it’s Chairman for business acumen rather than one that is pasted over back pages for financial troubles, contract breaches etc etc?

I still remain undecided on the franchise system and think they do need to make on the pitch have more significance… BUT you can’t deny the basic fundamentals are needed to stop another Fax (2003?) and Widnes 2007 from happening again, surely?'"


I sort of part agree with you.

I too agree with the principles of franchising and what it was supposed to do, by allowing clubs to build and bring through british players without the need to bring in more overseas players to ensure they beat the relegation trap. However I am not sure that this has happened as all superleague clubs, when making their announcements for next season are announcing Australian after Australian after NewZealander.

It does sadden me that promotion and relegation is still not here and I am one who thinks that we are not really ready, administratively, for superleague and I agree with some posters who say that, whilst Superleague is not really an option for the next four years (at least) what we can do is use that time to grow as a club, put in a full structured set up and be the best in our division.

I think we all can guess which Championship club will be in Superleague next year and I say "well done" to them. Yes you can say that they will be rewarded for a mediocre playing season, but they knew the rules and have done what is required of them.

The danger we, and other clubs face, is that once the licences for 2012 are announced will the "ticked box" be re-set. In which case we will not be able to accept a mediocre season to build the rest of the setup, as we will need to re-tick one of the boxes in the next three years.

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Quote: Haggis Fax "It doesn't worry me that we might not get in to Super League in 2012 or 2015, it angers and saddens me.

Franchising stinks. It's meant to create a level playing field but in reality it doesn't. It's only really in the USA where it works but thats because of the college draft system. We don't have that and we never will so how on earth does the franchising system allow a team which finishes bottom of the league build a new team to finish top?

You can't answer because the RFL does not have a plan which delivers that.

Imagine if Catalans were given the pick of this years maturing Academy players. Imagine if the Academies were at Universities which meant that young players were given an education which would help them when inevitably, most of them didn't make the grade. Stop imagining because it will never happen - but thats how the USA makes franchising work for them.

So what are we left with I ask?

1. A Super League where a poor season goes unpunished and a Division below where the rewards for success do not exist.

2. A set up which delivers nothing nationally (the national team is worse than before Super League began and International Rugby League is a joke which is no longer funny).

I'd hate to be a Widnes fan. Chances are in 2012 they will be playing Super League. Not for being the best team over a season or by being the best team on the day as we were just over 2 weeks ago. They will be in Super League because their board took the decision to allow mediocrity. They took the decision that meant they had to endure a mediocre season with no hope of winning anything purely because you'd ticked a box in 2009.

Why do we allow this to happen in our sport? Why is mediocre good? Why is it acceptable? Whenever I listen to Talksport they're forever banging on about Arsenal, Wolves, Stoke etc accepting mediocrity in their various forms and saying how it is killing football. Why do we not kick up more of a stink about Catalan and Harlequins?

I'm not having a pop at Widnes here. You knew the rules and I think your board have been far cleverer than ours by building a structure which gives the RFL what they want. I fully expect that the RFL already know who will be in Super League in 2012 so I say to you Widnes fans - enjoy the big time but then ask yourself the question - does it actually mean anything?

You won't be there by being the best, you won't be there through an inspirational season. But then again, in a sport where being the best is no longer important - why care?'"



Er the BIGGEST difference between us and Widnes is that they have Steve O'Connor who has MONEY and can make things happen for them where we just cannot afford to such as a reserve and youth set up!

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Quote: J20 "You need to look at it with a more open mind as well though, In total honesty I agree with the principles of franchising but I just don’t agree with the way the RFL are going about it and like other things, how quickly they implemented it without thinking it through.

You say it’s no better for the international game BUT would Widnes have invested as much in the academy if was P&R? Would Fev and Halifax now be talking seriously about doing so? No they wouldn’t. This stuff doesn’t change overnight! Would Widnes be running on a sound business plan now? Unlikely.

You guy’s were on here saying if you didn’t win this 100k it would be financial suicide (like we saw going for broke in 2007) yet now your saying your ‘plan’ is the best way to do things?

You go on about accepting mediocrity (one I don’t agree are squad start of the year was very strong on paper at least) but two, one of your posters said they’d feel cheated as a Widnes fan… BUT… Who cheated us more?


The board who spent more then the CLUB could afford to have a winning side on the park reaching Grand Finals yet then when it didn’t pay off on what is really an 80m lottery my club ended up in administration and (though highly unlikely) in a position where I may not have had a club anymore.

Or…

The board who got a grip of the finances, plugged a few leaks and started looking for some strong partnerships with other business. Still spent up to full cap but didn’t try and work around it pumping thousands in the first team for again something that may not guarantee SL at the end of the season? A board that has secured the long term future of my rugby club and is investing massively into the hot bed of local youth in the region? A club that wins awards as does it’s Chairman for business acumen rather than one that is pasted over back pages for financial troubles, contract breaches etc etc?

I still remain undecided on the franchise system and think they do need to make on the pitch have more significance… BUT you can’t deny the basic fundamentals are needed to stop another Fax (2003?) and Widnes 2007 from happening again, surely?'"


Er what about Harlequins the other year and Celtic Crusaders in 2009???
Most SL clubs are skint and in debt so how has the Franchise system made that better then clever clogs???

As for Widnes yes you appear to have stability but it is all down to having the money through Steve O'Connor end of story, the Stobbart stadium is not a coincidence is it???

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Quote: Fax4Life "Er what about Harlequins the other year and Celtic Crusaders in 2009???
Most SL clubs are skint and in debt so how has the Franchise system made that better then clever clogs???

As for Widnes yes you appear to have stability but it is all down to having the money through Steve O'Connor end of story, the Stobbart stadium is not a coincidence is it???'"


A coincidence to what?

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