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FORUMS > The Sin Bin > General Election 8th June
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Quote: DGM "Doesn't empathy go against the whole Tory ideology?
Unless empathy and selfish are the same thing, it will be a long wait.
Mrs May has spouted hot air about fair society for months but, they are just empty words.
Nobody knows what she actually thinks because it seems to change with each day of the week but, she is lacking any attribute that you would want from a leader.
No conviction, no principles, no leadership and no bottle.

FWIW I dont think that Corbyn has got all of those attributes but, he does seem to have some principles (even if I dont agree with some of them).

Everyone knows that she has to go, it's just a matter of time and delaying getting rid isn't helping anyone.

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Quote: DGM "Doesn't empathy go against the whole Tory ideology?
There are MPs in both parties Brown hardly did himself any favours in 2010 icon_biggrin.gif

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Quote: wrencat1873 "Unless empathy and selfish are the same thing, it will be a long wait.
Mrs May has spouted hot air about fair society for months but, they are just empty words.
Nobody knows what she actually thinks because it seems to change with each day of the week but, she is lacking any attribute that you would want from a leader.
No conviction, no principles, no leadership and no bottle.

FWIW I dont think that Corbyn has got all of those attributes but, he does seem to have some principles (even if I dont agree with some of them).

Everyone knows that she has to go, it's just a matter of time and delaying getting rid isn't helping anyone.'"


Completely agree - she has to go and soon - no spine whatsoever

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As my unlikely new hero MC Saskilla said during an interview with Victoria Derbyshire the other day: "Theresa May doesn’t care about the mandem, she don’t care about the gyaldem, she don’t care about the under privilege, she don’t even care about black people, she don’t care about nobody, let’s be real."

Although I'd amend it slightly - what she cares about is clinging on to power at, it appears, any cost - including the tentative peace in Northern Ireland. Her own MP's are now having to defend and justify her robotic incompetence - and they won't put up with that for long, as the Tories hate weakness; she'll be gone before conference.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "If that is what the government can afford then yes it is - why should this be any different from a commercial enterprise which incidentally is actual funding the increase.

Is it OK to award pay increases if productivity drops - a simple yes or no to both questions will do nicely'"


On point 2, I agree.

On point 1, I dont know if you are being deliberately daft or, whether you understand how local government in funded ?
The only way for local government to increase it's income is from local council tax or government grants, they aren't selling chocolate bars that they can increase the price or, make the bar smaller or, put out a 3 for 2 offer.
Their revenue comes from me and you and if we dont adequately fund our local services and reward the staff properly, what will happen to those services ?
Yes they can alway manage costs a little better and maximise the efficiency of their various departments, just like any other business but, then what ?
We've had the brakes on for the last 7 years, how much longer do you want to reduce the living standards of those who work in these organisations or should they employ people who cant find work elsewhere and are just "happy" to have a job.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "On point 2, I agree.

On point 1, I dont know if you are being deliberately daft or, whether you understand how local government in funded ?
The only way for local government to increase it's income is from local council tax or government grants, they aren't selling chocolate bars that they can increase the price or, make the bar smaller or, put out a 3 for 2 offer.
Their revenue comes from me and you and if we dont adequately fund our local services and reward the staff properly, what will happen to those services ?
Yes they can alway manage costs a little better and maximise the efficiency of their various departments, just like any other business but, then what ?
We've had the brakes on for the last 7 years, how much longer do you want to reduce the living standards of those who work in these organisations or should they employ people who cant find work elsewhere and are just "happy" to have a job.'"


I think you don't understand productivity - productivity isn't an increase in revenue its a way of doing the same with less resource or doing more with the same resource. This country has one of the lowest productivity rates in the EU perhaps if we increased our productivity the brakes would be released - just a thought?

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Quote: bren2k "As my unlikely new hero MC Saskilla said during an interview with Victoria Derbyshire the other day

Agreed - she cannot last behaving the way she is.

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So Jeremy Corbyn went to visit the people who live around Grenfell as did the Queen, but Theresa 'Robot' May wont. Is this really the kind of person who wants the best for our country?

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Quote: bren2k "what she cares about is clinging on to power at, it appears, any cost'"


And why is her hubby always hanging about like a bad smell? Is he just making sure wifey is acting in his, I mean the country's best interests?

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Quote: wrencat1873 "On point 2, I agree.

On point 1, I dont know if you are being deliberately daft or, whether you understand how local government in funded ?
The only way for local government to increase it's income is from local council tax or government grants, they aren't selling chocolate bars that they can increase the price or, make the bar smaller or, put out a 3 for 2 offer.
Their revenue comes from me and you and if we dont adequately fund our local services and reward the staff properly, what will happen to those services ?
Yes they can alway manage costs a little better and maximise the efficiency of their various departments, just like any other business but, then what ?
We've had the brakes on for the last 7 years, how much longer do you want to reduce the living standards of those who work in these organisations or should they employ people who cant find work elsewhere and are just "happy" to have a job.'"


I don't know why you're engaging with this facile, Trumpesque argument that a country can be run like a business - it patently can't, and to distill it down to such simplistic notions misses even the most obvious differences between the two.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "I think you don't understand productivity - productivity isn't an increase in revenue its a way of doing the same with less resource or doing more with the same resource. This country has one of the lowest productivity rates in the EU perhaps if we increased our productivity the brakes would be released - just a thought?'"


Yes, I covered that one with "an increase in efficiency"

Even if the brakes were released AND there was an increase in efficiency, which going by numbers of patients treated in the NHS, does seem to have increased in some areas, Mrs May, STILL doesn't want to pay these people more than the 1% cap allows.

BTW, having been a company director for 25 years, I think I might know a little bit about productivity and cost management a026.gif

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Quote: bren2k "I don't know why you're engaging with this facile, Trumpesque argument that a country can be run like a business - it patently can't, and to distill it down to such simplistic notions misses even the most obvious differences between the two.'"


No one is saying it should be run like a business - however the basic principles of operational and fiscal cost control and the drive to do things in a more efficient manner should still apply to the public sector?

1% efficiency saving in the NHS is worth £800m - that is my argument with Corbyn - who has suggested nothing about efficiency savings all he is saying is let's throw money at it primarily pay people more to do the same job.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "Yes, I covered that one with "an increase in efficiency"

Even if the brakes were released AND there was an increase in efficiency, which going by numbers of patients treated in the NHS, does seem to have increased in some areas, Mrs May, STILL doesn't want to pay these people more than the 1% cap allows.

BTW, having been a company director for 25 years, I think I might know a little bit about productivity and cost management
If you have been a director as long as you say then you would understand that the finances are not a bottomless pit and difficult choices sometimes have to be made. It easy in Jeremy's world - just give everyone what they want but you like I know that simply isn't possible in the real world.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "If you have been a director as long as you say then you would understand that the finances are not a bottomless pit and difficult choices sometimes have to be made. It easy in Jeremy's world - just give everyone what they want but you like I know that simply isn't possible in the real world.'"

Corbyn is a Bruce Almighty!!

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Quote: Sal Paradise "If you have been a director as long as you say then you would understand that the finances are not a bottomless pit and difficult choices sometimes have to be made. It easy in Jeremy's world - just give everyone what they want but you like I know that simply isn't possible in the real world.'"


Of course choices have to be made BUT, it's fundamentally wrong to effectively force a wage freeze (a reduction in real terms) on people that carry out services on our behalf, which is what all public servants do, whether they are teachers, nurses, care staff, road sweepers etc, etc.

The point is, and I do know that there isnt a bottomless pit that, you cannot suppress the wages of these people indefinitely, it's not right.
It's akin to your boss or, you, if you are the Chief Exec where you work, pumping up his salary year on year and giving his workers the same.
Whatever happened to the "we're in this together, when the austerity measures were first announced.
I'm not advocating double figure percentage increases but, IF we want decent public services, we cant keep squeezing them indefinitely.

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17:30
Catalans
v
Wigan
 Sun 25th May 2025
       League One 2025-R10
14:00
Midlands
v
Whitehaven
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
15:00
Wakefield
v
Salford
       League One 2025-R10
15:00
Keighley
v
Crusaders
15:00
Rochdale
v
Newcastle
15:00
Swinton
v
Cornwall
15:00
Workington
v
Goole V
 Thu 29th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
20:00
Huddersfield
v
Leigh
 Fri 30th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
20:00
Hull KR
v
St.Helens
20:00
Salford
v
Wigan
 Sat 31st May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
14:30
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sun 1st Jun 2025
       League One 2025-R11
13:00
Cornwall
v
Goole V
14:00
Midlands
v
Swinton
14:30
Crusaders
v
Rochdale
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
15:00
Warrington
v
Castleford
       League One 2025-R11
15:00
Newcastle
v
Keighley
15:00
Workington
v
Dewsbury
 Fri 13th Jun 2025
       League One 2025-R12
19:00
Dewsbury
v
Goole V
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
20:00
Hull FC
v
Castleford
20:00
Hull KR
v
Catalans
 Sat 14th Jun 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Wigan
17:30
Leeds
v
Warrington
 Sun 15th Jun 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
14:30
Wakefield
v
Leigh
       League One 2025-R12
14:30
Crusaders
v
Midlands
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
15:00
Salford
v
St.Helens
       League One 2025-R12
15:00
Keighley
v
Rochdale
15:00
Swinton
v
Workington
15:00
Whitehaven
v
Cornwall
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Fri 28th Feb
SL
20:00
Huddersfield-Hull FC
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Salford
SL
20:00
Leigh-Catalans
Sat 1st Mar
SL
14:30
Wakefield-St.Helens
SL
21:30
Wigan-Warrington
Sun 2nd Mar
SL
15:00
Leeds-Castleford
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
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