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Quote: rumpelstiltskin "Love how all you Plastic Paddys are forever chelping on about Bloody Sunday. If you are going to take part in a banned parade and finish off the day by lobbing bricks,nail and petrol bombs, and various missiles at armed soldiers, then you have to expect some consequences.Granted, you shouldn't really expect to be shot, after all, gratuitous slaughter of innocent civilians is supposed to the preserve of your bold freedom fighters!

The Paras and the Royal Anglians should have shown some restraint, despite the provocation and reports of Martin and his Thompson machine gun. Simply applying traditional NI methods, ie grab the nearest little scrot who has been throwing rocks or a petrol bomb, take him around the side of the Landie or Pig, and knock the crap out of him should have sufficed. Instant karma, and saves wasting lots of peoples time in paperwork, court appearances etc.

That said, the figures show for the Troubles, 363 killed by the British Military.....1016 by Protestant Paramilitaries......and 2060 by Republicans. I think we can allow the Brit Army a bit of leeway for having a bad day at the Londonderry office, way back then in 1972.

However, back to Martin. If I (and here I include that fine upstanding terrorist Gerry Adams) was on the IRA Army Council, only to be told that of the total number of catholics killed (1523) over 25% were by Republicans! You can see why the man is peeved. Even by bog trotting standards that is embarrassing, and is it any wonder he took himself, and Gerry off to Stormont?

And you have to give them credit for the excellent PR reinvention of themselves...

In one bound, Paramilitaries to Parliamentarian.'"



Possibly why those demostrating on Bloody Sunday thought to hell with this non violence stuff im joining the Pira and then served some instant Karma to those same paras at Warrenpoint icon_idea.gif

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Quote: El Barbudo "
Kneecapping in NI was a routine punishment, not for being on the other side per se but as part of the IRAs gangsterism and power retention......'"


This is what always springs to mind when the term "freedom fighters" is used with reference the IRA. They were every bit as much a bunch of crooks as freedom fighters. The royalists paramilitaries were no different either.

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Quote: Kosh "

Really. How many members of McGuiness's family was she personally involved in killing?'"


You can't be a head of state, and take all the luxuries that the role brings with it, and not take the responsibilities that it brings.

One of those responsibilities is that the British Forces are HER forces and do their work in her name.....If some of their work is killing innocents, who are protesting about the injustice that HER government is imposing on them, then I'm afraid she is a very legitimate target.

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Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "You can't be a head of state, and take all the luxuries that the role brings with it, and not take the responsibilities that it brings.

One of those responsibilities is that the British Forces are HER forces and do their work in her name.....If some of their work is killing innocents, who are protesting about the injustice that HER government is imposing on them, then I'm afraid she is a very legitimate target.'"

So you reckon that a figurehead with no actual political power is directly comparable to someone who either plants bombs that kill innocents or directly orders that to be done with the specific intention of killing innocents?

Your moral compass is buggered.

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Quote: Kosh "So you reckon that a figurehead with no actual political power is directly comparable to someone who either plants bombs that kill innocents or directly orders that to be done with the specific intention of killing innocents?

Your moral compass is buggered.'"


Yes I do.....Rather than exposing my moral compass, it probably highlights the absurd idea of a posh bird living in a palace, supposedly ruling a country??

Surely you can't enjoy the luxury of being head of the Armed Forces, without bearing some responsibility for their occasional barbaric actions??

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Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "Yes I do.....Rather than exposing my moral compass, it probably highlights the absurd idea of a posh bird living in a palace, supposedly ruling a country??

Surely you can't enjoy the luxury of being head of the Armed Forces, without bearing some responsibility for their occasional barbaric actions??'"

Do you understand the difference between a toothless figurehead and an actual policy/decision maker? And you do understand the Queen doesn't 'rule' the country, even 'supposedly'? icon_lol.gif

But, carry on referring to people "legitimate targets", it clearly helps you feel 'right-on' about what was nothing more than cold-blooded murder, very often of civilians, by gangs of criminals over a few decades. Many Provos and certainly most of the 'Real' simply used the Troubles as a means of gaining criminal power, that's the truth of it. Just have a look at who runs most of the drugs and other criminal gangs in NI these days.

Sorry, but I can't look at McGuinness without seeing a murdering b4stard. Yes, the British carried out some questionable acts and made mistakes, but at least they learned from their mistakes and introduced rules of engagement. In the meantime your hero was still planting bombs and killing men, women and children in town centres. A fine role model.

I'm not blind to the cause of the Republicans but to legitimise their methods is laughable. What he's achieved as a politician is positive but as a paramilitary leader he was nothing but a murderer, and that's why I find his involvement distasteful.

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Quote: rumpelstiltskin "
That said, the figures show for the Troubles, 363 killed by the British Military.....1016 by Protestant Paramilitaries......and 2060 by Republicans. I think we can allow the Brit Army a bit of leeway for having a bad day at the Londonderry office, way back then in 1972.

However, back to Martin. If I (and here I include that fine upstanding terrorist Gerry Adams) was on the IRA Army Council, only to be told that of the total number of catholics killed (1523) over 25% were by Republicans! You can see why the man is peeved. Even by bog trotting standards that is embarrassing, and is it any wonder he took himself, and Gerry off to Stormont?

And you have to give them credit for the excellent PR reinvention of themselves...

In one bound, Paramilitaries to Parliamentarian.'"


Nice language BTW! Even using your own source of information you can see the majority of civilians killed in the troubles were by Loyalist paramilitaries. They also accounted for twice as many of their own as they did Republican paramilitaries and even a smattering of British security forces. Hardly sustainable was it?

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Quote: ryano "Nice language BTW! Even using your own source of information you can see the majority of civilians killed in the troubles were by Loyalist paramilitaries. They also accounted for twice as many of their own as they did Republican paramilitaries and even a smattering of British security forces. Hardly sustainable was it?'"


The reason that the army were there in the first place was to protect the Catholics from loyalist gangs, you could say they were the real start of the troubles. Also the UVF and UFF weren't as well organised or as well equiped as the Provos due to not having thousands of plastic paddy yanks and a certain, recently deceased African dictator proping them up.

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Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "Yes I do.....Rather than exposing my moral compass, it probably highlights the absurd idea of a posh bird living in a palace, supposedly ruling a country??

Surely you can't enjoy the luxury of being head of the Armed Forces, without bearing some responsibility for their occasional barbaric actions??'"

Look - I realise that you're just trying to be 'edgy' and 'cool' but stop and think about what you're posting. Then have a word with yourself.

Deary me. icon_rolleyes.gif

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It only works one way with Republicans, just think of the stink they still kick up about Loughgall.

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Quote: Cronus "Do you understand the difference between a toothless figurehead and an actual policy/decision maker? And you do understand the Queen doesn't 'rule' the country, even 'supposedly'? aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2005/09 ... itson.html.

Fascinating stuff about arming pseudo gangs to do the dirty work and then allow the official State forces to present themselves as neutral.
Quote: wigan_rlfc "The reason that the army were there in the first place was to protect the Catholics from loyalist gangs, you could say they were the real start of the troubles. Also the UVF and UFF weren't as well organised or as well equiped as the Provos due to not having thousands of plastic paddy yanks and a certain, recently deceased African dictator proping them up.'"



You ought to read a little more. The army went in because the Police could not cope with the civil unrest. They may have been initially seen as neutral arbiters but very quickly showed their real role and that was to maintain the status quo in Ireland. They did not protect Catholics at all.

As for the Loyalist paramilitaries not being organised you should check out their history. Many of them were armed and supported by the British establishment from the RUC, Special branch, Army intelligence the UDR etc. Most of this was part of British counter insurgency strategy developed in Malaya and Kenya. The main tenet of this was to support anti insurgent groupings you should read Frank Kitsons books ( he was the founder of British Insurgent policy) particularly his approach to Pseudo gangs. Here is a link.

aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2005/09 ... itson.html.

Fascinating stuff about arming pseudo gangs to do the dirty work and then allow the official State forces to present themselves as neutral.


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