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FORUMS > The Sin Bin > Boris Johnson - spinless leader ?
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Quote: Sal Paradise "I am not defending Johnson all I am saying is Labour is as bad if not worse and you have to attribute the direction of travel to it leader - you somehow think he is an honest broker - he cannot be excluded from all the lies the Labour party is telling. As you say it is just wrong, but you seem to either defend or ignore these Labour lies.

In the last week they have jumped on two policies - WASPI and today train costs - neither of which were in their manifesto neither of which have been costed - where does it stop? If Labour continue we wont be taxes they will be rewarding us for working - its bonkers even Stevie Wonder can see that - why can't you?'"


Labour wont win but, if/when the Tories win, we will be heading for a no deal Brexit at the end of 2020 which, may be ok if you are Farage or, on the right of the Tory Party but, this would be the worst of all outcomes.
Of course, the EU will be blamed, the Tories and Boris in particular are exceptional at blaming others for their own problems but, this wont change where we are heading.
The only way that this wont be the case is, if the EU cave in during the negotiations and that just wont happen.

Oh yes and the UK will be in recession at that point, bringing further austerity, rising crime etc, etc - you know, like we've seen over the past 10 years.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "
Of course, the EU will be blamed, the Tories and Boris in particular are exceptional at blaming others for their own problems but, this wont change where we are heading.
'"

This is one of the great ironies. The Conservative party demand everyone in the country take personal responsibility for each individual's actions and the consequences arising from them.

But as soon as it comes to the party owning their record, the disaster of Brexit and the tragic state of our public services they point fingers all over the place. It's never their fault.

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Quote: The Ghost of '99 "This is one of the great ironies. The Conservative party demand everyone in the country take personal responsibility for each individual's actions and the consequences arising from them.

But as soon as it comes to the party owning their record, the disaster of Brexit and the tragic state of our public services they point fingers all over the place. It's never their fault.'"


I think you are correct - nobody to blame but May and her team - she really screwed things up - she was out negotiated, easily done when you don't have any conviction in what you are trying to achieve.

You can't blame Boris for what he inherited in respect of Brexit - it was a complete car crash. Add to that a parliament that had 70% remainers including a host of Tories and you have an almost impossible task of achieving anything but a very soft Brexit.

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Johnson was part of the car crash. They had the numbers to get the deal through but failed because of Johnson and the ERG.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "Labour wont win but, if/when the Tories win, we will be heading for a no deal Brexit at the end of 2020 which, may be ok if you are Farage or, on the right of the Tory Party but, this would be the worst of all outcomes.
Of course, the EU will be blamed, the Tories and Boris in particular are exceptional at blaming others for their own problems but, this wont change where we are heading.
The only way that this wont be the case is, if the EU cave in during the negotiations and that just wont happen.

Oh yes and the UK will be in recession at that point, bringing further austerity, rising crime etc, etc - you know, like we've seen over the past 10 years.'"


I don't share your negativity - maybe because I think we are a pretty innovative nation and business will always find a way. Nobody including the EU want a no deal Brexit and a solution will be found provided the Tories have sufficient majority to control parliament.

If Labour get in there will be some huge problems - as a nation we are heavily reliant on individual debt - even a small rise in interest rates combined with higher personal taxation will see a huge issue in the housing market - people simply will not be able to pay their mortgages. It isn't possible to fund all the give-aways that Labour propose by just taxing the rich and companies. It will impact ordinary people earning especially low earners.

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Quote: Scarlet Pimpernell "Johnson was part of the car crash. They had the numbers to get the deal through but failed because of Johnson and the ERG.'"


The only time it came close - the third time Johnson voted for it - just remind me how many Labour MPs voted against it, they had vowed to support the result of the referendum?

Given the circumstances of the deal negotiations I doubt anyone could have done anything better - it had disaster written all over it. Boris' deal is just the best of a really bad job.

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Johnson deal is the same with one exception, May would not condone a border in Ireland unfortunately Johnson is quite happy to do so and even lie about its impact.
I note Johnson in lieu of the interview with Andrew Neil he is to be interviewed by Philip Schofield.

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Quote: Scarlet Pimpernell "Johnson deal is the same with one exception, May would not condone a border in Ireland unfortunately Johnson is quite happy to do so and even lie about its impact.
I note Johnson in lieu of the interview with Andrew Neil he is to be interviewed by Philip Schofield.'"


Might as well be Gordon the Gopher, then they can speak nonsense to each other
Gordon "squeaks"
Johnson "yes, I know but, lets just look at the last 120 days"
Gordon "squeak"
Johnson babbles on and on and on with his pre rehed sound bites. d040.gif

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Quote: Scarlet Pimpernell "Johnson deal is the same with one exception, May would not condone a border in Ireland unfortunately Johnson is quite happy to do so and even lie about its impact.
I note Johnson in lieu of the interview with Andrew Neil he is to be interviewed by Philip Schofield.'"


As I said he inherited a bag of spanners and he had a parliament that was working against him - his own fault by the way.

Shows he is a bit cleverer than Corbyn then - let's face it Neil's sole purpose is to make everyone look bad no matter who.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "As I said he inherited a bag of spanners and he had a parliament that was working against him - his own fault by the way.

Shows he is a bit cleverer than Corbyn then - let's face it Neil's sole purpose is to make everyone look bad no matter who.'"


Brexit is "a bag of spanners", trying to deliver the impossible (leaving the EU & Customs union and a free trade agreement, whilst not driving a bus through the good Friday agreement etc, etc) and having failed to meet all of the criteria, N. Ireland, due to it's low population numbers and the minimal damage to Tory aspirations, has been thrown under the bus - Johnson is still in denial about the need for any customs checks, despite the fact that there is a direct border with Eire (the EU) - allowing people and goods to move "freely" in that part of the UK.
As I've already said, the free trade deal wont get through and we will end up leaving with no deal, which WILL put the skids under all of Johnsons spending pledges.

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At least he will have secured blue passports and Freeports when we leave.

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Quote: Sal Paradise " just remind me how many Labour MPs voted against it, they had vowed to support the result of the referendum?
'"

This is a popular lie with the right wing media. In Labours 2017 manifesto they said they would support a Brexit that offered the benefits of remaining in the CU and the SM. So, as Johnsons deal didnt provide those benefits, they were quite within their rights to reject it.

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Quote: silver2 "This is a popular lie with the right wing media. In Labours 2017 manifesto they said they would support a Brexit that offered the benefits of remaining in the CU and the SM. So, as Johnsons deal didnt provide those benefits, they were quite within their rights to reject it.'"

You'll never get our resident Tories to admit that the failure to get the Brexit deals through was anything other than their own fault. The opposition has no responsibility to get a relatively hard Brexit like the May deal through - it went against their 2017 manifesto and doesn't meet their own base requirements.

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Which Donal Trump do we believe ?
"Everything is on the table"
or
"Wouldn't want the NHS if it was handed over on a silver platter"

Let's just think about this one for a nano second

The Tory press have lapped up his new quote though and it's front page news in all of the right wing press.
I wonder if Boris has now suggested removing "Pharma" from the future trade agreement - I dont think so.

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Quote: wrencat1873 "If Johnson has an hour with Andrew Neil, he will probably disappear in a pile of sweat and bluster.
How can such a coward be elected leader of anything.

A good time Charlie shouldn't be anywhere near the helm, what will he do when Trump asks him to bend over eusa_clap.gif eusa_clap.gif

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Catalans
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15:00
Rochdale
v
Goole V
       Championship 2025-R9
17:00
LondonB
v
York
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
17:15
Hull KR
v
Salford
       Championship 2025-R9
18:00
Toulouse
v
Halifax
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
19:30
St.Helens
v
Leeds
 Sun 4th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
13:00
Huddersfield
v
Hull FC
       League One 2025-R8
13:00
Cornwall
v
Midlands
       Championship 2025-R9
15:00
Batley
v
Barrow
15:00
Bradford
v
Sheffield
15:00
Doncaster
v
Oldham
15:00
Hunslet
v
Widnes
       League One 2025-R8
15:00
Swinton
v
Crusaders
15:00
Whitehaven
v
Dewsbury
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
15:15
Wigan
v
Warrington
17:30
Castleford
v
Wakefield
 Sat 10th May 2025
       Championship 2025-R10
17:00
Oldham
v
Toulouse
 Sun 11th May 2025
       League One 2025-R9
14:30
Crusaders
v
Newcastle
       Championship 2025-R10
15:00
Batley
v
Bradford
15:00
Halifax
v
Doncaster
15:00
LondonB
v
Sheffield
15:00
Widnes
v
Featherstone
15:00
York
v
Hunslet
       League One 2025-R9
15:00
Dewsbury
v
Cornwall
15:00
Keighley
v
Workington
15:00
Rochdale
v
Midlands
15:00
Whitehaven
v
Goole V
 Thu 15th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
20:00
St.Helens
v
Catalans
 Fri 16th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
20:00
Leeds
v
Hull FC
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Sat 17th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
15:00
Hull KR
v
Huddersfield
 Sun 18th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
15:00
Wakefield
v
Warrington
17:30
Castleford
v
Salford
 Thu 22nd May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
20:00
Leigh
v
Hull FC
 Fri 23rd May 2025
       Championship 2025-R11
19:30
Sheffield
v
Hunslet
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
20:00
Huddersfield
v
St.Helens
20:00
Warrington
v
Hull KR
 Sat 24th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
14:30
Castleford
v
Leeds
17:30
Catalans
v
Wigan
       Championship 2025-R11
18:00
Toulouse
v
Barrow
 Sun 25th May 2025
       League One 2025-R10
14:00
Midlands
v
Whitehaven
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
15:00
Wakefield
v
Salford
       Championship 2025-R11
15:00
Bradford
v
Widnes
15:00
Doncaster
v
LondonB
15:00
Featherstone
v
Batley
15:00
Oldham
v
Halifax
       League One 2025-R10
15:00
Keighley
v
Crusaders
15:00
Rochdale
v
Newcastle
15:00
Swinton
v
Cornwall
15:00
Workington
v
Goole V
 Thu 29th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
20:00
Huddersfield
v
Leigh
 Fri 30th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
20:00
Hull KR
v
St.Helens
20:00
Salford
v
Wigan
 Sat 31st May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
14:30
Leeds
v
Wakefield
       Championship 2025-R12
17:00
LondonB
v
Widnes
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
17:30
Catalans
v
Hull FC
       Championship 2025-R12
18:00
Batley
v
Toulouse
 Sun 1st Jun 2025
       League One 2025-R11
13:00
Cornwall
v
Goole V
14:00
Midlands
v
Swinton
14:30
Crusaders
v
Rochdale
     Mens Super League XXX-R13
15:00
Warrington
v
Castleford
       Championship 2025-R12
15:00
Barrow
v
Featherstone
15:00
Doncaster
v
Bradford
15:00
Hunslet
v
Oldham
15:00
York
v
Sheffield
       League One 2025-R11
15:00
Newcastle
v
Keighley
15:00
Workington
v
Dewsbury
 Fri 13th Jun 2025
       League One 2025-R12
19:00
Dewsbury
v
Goole V
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
20:00
Hull FC
v
Castleford
20:00
Hull KR
v
Catalans
 Sat 14th Jun 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Wigan
17:30
Leeds
v
Warrington
 Sun 15th Jun 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
14:30
Wakefield
v
Leigh
       League One 2025-R12
14:30
Crusaders
v
Midlands
     Mens Super League XXX-R14
15:00
Salford
v
St.Helens
       Championship 2025-R13
15:00
Barrow
v
Sheffield
15:00
Batley
v
Doncaster
15:00
Bradford
v
York
15:00
Featherstone
v
Hunslet
15:00
Widnes
v
Halifax
15:00
Toulouse
v
LondonB
       League One 2025-R12
15:00
Keighley
v
Rochdale
15:00
Swinton
v
Workington
15:00
Whitehaven
v
Cornwall
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Fri 28th Feb
SL
20:00
Huddersfield-Hull FC
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Salford
SL
20:00
Leigh-Catalans
Sat 1st Mar
SL
14:30
Wakefield-St.Helens
SL
21:30
Wigan-Warrington
Sun 2nd Mar
SL
15:00
Leeds-Castleford
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
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