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As in sport corbyn seems to be on a roll, certainly the momentum seems to be with him. No pun intended. May and the tories campaign has been abysmal. However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.
Potentially some political volatile situations are likely. Example 1 -hung parliament with labour and snp voting together .
Example-2 no Tory majority, who will represent us in brexit talks. Example -3 labour and snp- plus liberals deciding the time is not right to exit the eu.
Meanwhile thanks to this foolhardy election we are well into the 2 year Eu exit frame, with no meaningful negotiations underway.
I notice all talk of the Labour Party falling apart have disappeared. The pound is thinking of dropping down to parity with the dollar. All this uncertainty and political upheaval does not bode well for Eu negotiations.

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Your job is to say to yourself on a job interview does the hiring manager likes me or not. If you aren't a particular manager's cup of tea, you haven't failed -- you've dodged a bullet.:icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg



Quote: bren2k "No I don't miss your point - you're just wilfully misinformed, thanks I suspect, to your refusal to waver from the Tory/Daily Mail dogma. Google the Broken Windows theory of crime and disorder - then think again about whether community policing impacts positively on more serious crime.

Your second point is a different one - nobody would deny that there has been corruption and malfeasance in certain forces; it's rather a stretch though to use Hillsborough as an example in support of Mrs May's savage cuts to the police force. Which government (and newspaper) colluded with the corrupt South Yorkshire force, not only over Hillsborough, but also prior to that during the miners strike?'"


I have never used Hillsborough to support the cuts in policing - I used Hillsborough as an example of why I have little respect for the police and their insular behaviour. Their arrogance does them no favours IMO.

With regards to having more community policing perhaps you could explain why crime numbers have been falling in line with reducing policing numbers? I know what you will say - we can all find articles that support our views doesn't validate yours anymore than a article with a polarised opinion.
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Quote: Bullseye "I think it's important to differentiate between the lessons SYP have obviously learnt from dealing with the incident to the more murky goings on around the cover up and attempts to blame supporters for what happened.

I do know many of the officers to blame for those murky goings on are long gone.'"


As with the Cliff Richard debacle SYP do not seem to have learnt any lessons - they may talk the talk but their recent actions suggest they haven't learnt a thing

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Quote: Backwoodsman "As in sport corbyn seems to be on a roll, certainly the momentum seems to be with him. No pun intended. May and the tories campaign has been abysmal. However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.
Potentially some political volatile situations are likely. Example 1 -hung parliament with labour and snp voting together .
Example-2 no Tory majority, who will represent us in brexit talks. Example -3 labour and snp- plus liberals deciding the time is not right to exit the eu.
Meanwhile thanks to this foolhardy election we are well into the 2 year Eu exit frame, with no meaningful negotiations underway.
I notice all talk of the Labour Party falling apart have disappeared. The pound is thinking of dropping down to parity with the dollar. All this uncertainty and political upheaval does not bode well for Eu negotiations.'"


Just a small point of order.
Although the referendum was 12 months ago, article 50 was only triggered on 20th March 2017 (9/10 weeks ago) and with the German Elections just around the corner (24th September), not much was likely to happen in the first few months.
Who ever puts a government together will take charge of the Brexit negotiations but, as you intimate, they would certainly change direction if the SNP holds the balance of power, which ironically would put the skids under the SNP's dreams of a second referendum for their own independence.

Just repeat "strong and stable", "strong and stable", "strong and stable", "strong and stable" and everything will be just fine icon_lol.gif icon_lol.gif icon_lol.gif

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“At last, a real, Tory budget,” Daily Mail 24/9/22 "It may be that the honourable gentleman doesn't like mixing with his own side … but we on this side have a more convivial, fraternal spirit." Jacob Rees-Mogg 21/10/21 A member of the Guardian-reading, tofu-eating wokerati.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_755.jpg



Quote: Backwoodsman "However it's difficult to compete with corbyns give everybody everything, don't worry the rich will pay. Unfortunately the rich won't pay as under the Wilson government they will bugger off.'"


Given that Labour are shockingly threatening that the income tax rate would rise to 45p for earnings above £80,000 and then to 50p in each pound earned over £123,000; where are all these selfish, greedy tax-avoiders going to go? Belarus has pretty low taxation, as do plenty of Arab dictatorships. If they don't want to pay their fair share I am happy for them to sod off. I'd be happy to launch a crowd-funding site to pay their air fare.

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Quote: tigertot "Given that Labour are shockingly threatening that the income tax rate would rise to 45p for earnings above £80,000 and then to 50p in each pound earned over £123,000; where are all these selfish, greedy tax-avoiders going to go? Belarus has pretty low taxation, as do plenty of Arab dictatorships. If they don't want to pay their fair share I am happy for them to sod off. I'd be happy to launch a crowd-funding site to pay their air fare.'"


So its OK that 63% of what you earn should go to the government - seriously how is that equitable?

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Quote: Sal Paradise "So its OK that 63% of what you earn should go to the government - seriously how is that equitable?'"


You're forgetting the generous tax thresholds, they help everyone icon_biggrin.gif

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Quote: wrencat1873 "You're forgetting the generous tax thresholds, they help everyone
Over £40k you give more to the government than you earn for yourself !! over £80k that's grows 58% of what you earn and over 123k that's 63% - and no personal allowance - that's fair!!

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Quote: Sal Paradise "As with the Cliff Richard debacle SYP do not seem to have learnt any lessons - they may talk the talk but their recent actions suggest they haven't learnt a thing'"


Is that every person employed by SYP who have not learnt their lesson?

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Quote: Sal Paradise "Over £40k you give more to the government than you earn for yourself !! over £80k that's grows 58% of what you earn and over 123k that's 63% - and no personal allowance - that's fair!!'"


It's surely fair that people that can afford to contribute more, do so ?
Also, everyone gets their first £11.5k tax free, although you would have to deduct your taxable benefits (company car, health insurance etc) and then you end up with the dreaded "k" code.

I know that the Tory ethos is to "keep what you earn". However, too many have been doing just that (and big business too) even my business paid more corporation tax than Starbucks and their ilk and that certainly isn't right.???

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Quote: wrencat1873 "It's surely fair that people that can afford to contribute more, do so ?
Also, everyone gets their first £11.5k tax free, although you would have to deduct your taxable benefits (company car, health insurance etc) and then you end up with the dreaded "k" code.

I know that the Tory ethos is to "keep what you earn". However, too many have been doing just that (and big business too) even my business paid more corporation tax than Starbucks and their ilk and that certainly isn't right.???'"



If everyone gets taxed at 20% those that earn more pay more what is the issues with that?

If you earn over £123k you lose your personal allowance - you seemed to have overlooked that?

Was that Starbucks in the UK or world wide?

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Quote: Sal Paradise "If everyone gets taxed at 20% those that earn more pay more what is the issues with that?

If you earn over £123k you lose your personal allowance - you seemed to have overlooked that?

Was that Starbucks in the UK or world wide?'"


Now we have it.
You want the poor guy on minimum wage to leave himself with 10k a year to live on and the guy on £120k to "manage" on £100k.
Absolutely fair, especially when you take our food costs and a couple of kids.

I was referring to Starbuck in the UK that "devolved" its responsibilities to the Netherlands.
Following protests in the UK it has now slightly re organised and is contributing more but, there are many, many businesses doing the same.
Google is one of the largest culprits and moves funds from country to country to dilute and reduce its tax burden.
This may not be illegal but, it's certainly immoral.

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“At last, a real, Tory budget,” Daily Mail 24/9/22 "It may be that the honourable gentleman doesn't like mixing with his own side … but we on this side have a more convivial, fraternal spirit." Jacob Rees-Mogg 21/10/21 A member of the Guardian-reading, tofu-eating wokerati.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_755.jpg



Quote: Sal Paradise "So its OK that 63% of what you earn should go to the government - seriously how is that equitable?'"


Remember we're all in this together.

Those receiving housing benefit have paid the price.
The disabled have paid the price.
The elderly have paid the price.
Public sector workers have paid the price.
The armed forces have paid the price.
Schools have paid the price.
Students have paid the price.
Health workers have paid the price.
Social services have paid the price.
The richest have got richer.

Forgive me if I don't give a flying fu ck whether you or the richest 5% feel it iniquitous to pay some of their gains back. I note you are more affronted by those who can more than afford it having to pay a little more rather than the persecution of the poorest & weakest.

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Quote: tigertot "Given that Labour are shockingly threatening that the income tax rate would rise to 45p for earnings above £80,000 and then to 50p in each pound earned over £123,000; where are all these selfish, greedy tax-avoiders going to go? Belarus has pretty low taxation, as do plenty of Arab dictatorships. If they don't want to pay their fair share I am happy for them to sod off. I'd be happy to launch a crowd-funding site to pay their air fare.'"

Prior to being semi-retired I was a self employed sub contract industrial electrician earning over eighty thousand per annum.
Even now I could work in Canada , South Africa, Australia, New Zealand, Botswana, Dubai. I have paid more than my fair share of tax in this country.
I have also trained several highly skilled engineers and paid for them to attend technical college. So your attitude to me would be to sod off.
It might be unpalatable to you but in this day and age money has wings, companies and people will move to countries which suit them better. Don't forget quite a lot of high earners create employment for workers who inturn pay income tax.
If you use France as an example, high rates of income tax for high earners meant that literally thousands moved to London.
They now pay tax in London, presumably you will be happy to tell them to sod off.

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On tonights leaders debate!
Regardless of what anyone thinks of Corbyn I think May just scored another immense own goal! Not only did she leave herself open to accusations of running scared, but, her nominated stand in, Amber Rudd just pulled off a massive "I'm the next tory leader" performance. The tories are that cold blooded in their inside machinations that they will already be eyeing May's successor and Rudd just put down her marker!

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