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Quote: cod'ead "As opposed to a jolly Jack Tar, complete with bell-bottoms and whistling a hornpipe?

WTF is a "proper sailor"?'"


nah Coddy, that's only those poofs in the RN who ponce around Pompey dockyard !

a real sailor (like wot I woz) was a merchant seaman risking his his health with every whore he went through in whichever port in the world... icon_surprised.gifops:

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Quote: sanjunien "when Ted Heath
I think you're re-writing history here....Kinnock was leader of the Opposition at the time Margaret Thatcher was PM. He was calling for us to join the ERM while Maggie was insistent on us staying out. Kinnock wasn't jumping on the bandwagon he took the Labour party in a different direction from the way it had been before (under Foot they wanted withdrawal from the EEC) and in a different direction from where the Tories were (or where Thatcher was, not necessarily all her party).

Ultimately we went in because Lawson, Howe and Major all wanted us in, and after Lawson and Howe had quit and she had Major as Chancellor, she couldn't afford to fall out with another Chancellor at such a dicey time for her in the poll tax era.

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Quote: El Barbudo "Because of what happened to the pound when it was in the ERM, I think you mean.
i.e. Lamont sat in his office without even a TV to watch the currency markets and, as runners kep coming in to tell how much further the pound had fallen, kept throwing money at it, impotently waiting and waiting for instructions from the equally vacuous Major who didn't even contact him.
Then Lamont had the brass neck to say he'd never actually been keen on the ERM anyway ... didn't stop him from taking the job did it?

Yeah ... I think Blair had a point about Tory economic credibility after that, actually.
'"


I don't support the idea of any kind of European currency regime, ERM or Euro, however in fairness to the Tories on this one, they were damned if they did and damned if they didn't, in terms of 'credibility'. They had made the decision to go into the ERM and had made a firm commitment in the election of May 1992 that the UK's economic policy would be run from within the ERM. That is a signal to businesses that the UK will be an ERM member.

When four months later, the pound comes under pressure - do they decide to quit the ERM at the first sign of trouble? With hindsight that would have saved us a lot of money that day, because we blew billions on ill fated interventions, but if we had quit early on in the day what would that have said about the UK government's 'credibility' for any future statements on its economic policy.

Once they made the decision that the UK would be in the ERM (the wrong one, IMO, as Mrs Thatcher warned), they had to pull out all the stops to try and keep us in when we came under pressure.

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Quote: sally cinnamon "I think you're re-writing history here....Kinnock was leader of the Opposition at the time Margaret Thatcher was PM. He was calling for us to join the ERM while Maggie was insistent on us staying out. Kinnock wasn't jumping on the bandwagon he took the Labour party in a different direction from the way it had been before (under Foot they wanted withdrawal from the EEC) and in a different direction from where the Tories were (or where Thatcher was, not necessarily all her party).

Ultimately we went in because Lawson, Howe and Major all wanted us in, and after Lawson and Howe had quit and she had Major as Chancellor, she couldn't afford to fall out with another Chancellor at such a dicey time for her in the poll tax era.'"



not a case of re writing history

Mr Kinnock was a staunch euro sceptic in his early days - he moderated somewhat when he saw the direction the party was heading

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Quote: sanjunien "not a case of re writing history

Mr Kinnock was a staunch euro sceptic in his early days - he moderated somewhat when he saw the direction the party was heading'"


He took the party that way not the other way around.

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Quote: Big Graeme "He took the party that way not the other way around.'"


he didn't have a choice - it was either that or remain in obscurity with the embarassment of the loony left and all their troublemakers bugging the british electorate

Kinnock did a good job to turn things around eventually but even a brilliantly masterminded election campaign by Brian Gould wasn't good enough to oust La Dame de Fer !

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