FORUMS > The Sin Bin > The General Election Thread |
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| We should have two mew laws:
- UK residential property owned by non-EU citizens should be subject to an annual tax on value; and
- no newspapers / media outlets only to be controlled / owned by UK domiciled and resident individuals / companies.
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
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kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
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"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| Quote: Cibaman "Well no, not if Labour are happy to be kicked out at the next election.'"
LOL
The SNP would no more "pull Labour's strings" than the LimpDems have pulled the tories over the last five years.
We're looking at the very last of two-party politics. I reckon that if Labour do form the next government and in the absence of a very unlikely landslide, then consensus politics will be the way forward. To that end, we'll also be offered over the next five years, a proposal for some form of PR and reformation of the HoL. This may disappoint many left-wingers but would strike fear into the hearts of the tories, simply because they truly believe they were "born to rule".
We're heading for a federalist United Kingdom and that is the only way to keep the UK together
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Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 37704 | No Team Selected |
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
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kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
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"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| Quote: Dally "We should have two mew laws
That's getting to sound suspiciously like the LVT that I've been promoting for years. People can move, land cannot
Quote: Dally "and
- no newspapers / media outlets only to be controlled / owned by UK domiciled and resident individuals / companies.'"
Care to read and rewrite that again? It makes no sense at all
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| Quote: cod'ead "LOL
The SNP would no more "pull Labour's strings" than the LimpDems have pulled the tories over the last five years.
We're looking at the very last of two-party politics. I reckon that if Labour do form the next government and in the absence of a very unlikely landslide, then consensus politics will be the way forward. To that end, we'll also be offered over the next five years, a proposal for some form of PR and reformation of the HoL. This may disappoint many left-wingers but would strike fear into the hearts of the tories, simply because they truly believe they were "born to rule".
We're heading for a federalist United Kingdom and that is the only way to keep the UK together'"
What's the consensus between Labour and the SNP on Trident? Move it to Manchester?
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26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: Cibaman "I dont think that Labour will turn to the SNP as such. I think they will present their Queen's Speech and budget and dare the SNP to vote against it or abstain. The trouble is that Sturgeon seems to think that if the SNP vote down a Labour budget, Labour will simply come back with something more acceptable. Because that's how it works in Scotland.'"
The SNP have put themselves forward as an anti-Tory party as much as a nationalist party in this election (and in the referendum). What people may have forgotten is there are elections for the Scottish parliament in 2016.
Now you can't really appeal to disaffected Labour voters, then vote down a Labour government that then results in a Tory administration and expect to retain that support.
They would be just like the Lib Dems. Went to the country on one platform, anti-Tory, and enabled the thing they said they were against.
They have little choice but to back Labour, deal or no deal.
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26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: Cibaman "What's the consensus between Labour and the SNP on Trident? Move it to Manchester?'"
There doesn't need to be one. SNP can vote against. Labour and Tories vote for. Trident is renewed. It's obvious.
If the SNP made this a red line issue (which they have already said they won't....) then for reasons outlined in my previous post they won't be thanked for bringing a Labour govt. down if it lets the Tories in.
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Rank | Posts | Team |
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| Quote: Cibaman "What's the consensus between Labour and the SNP on Trident? Move it to Manchester?'"
Do you believe that if a Queen's Speech is defeated, then that means the end of the government?
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| Quote: DaveO "The SNP have put themselves forward as an anti-Tory party as much as a nationalist party in this election (and in the referendum). What people may have forgotten is there are elections for the Scottish parliament in 2016.
Now you can't really appeal to disaffected Labour voters, then vote down a Labour government that then results in a Tory administration and expect to retain that support.
They would be just like the Lib Dems. Went to the country on one platform, anti-Tory, and enabled the thing they said they were against.
They have little choice but to back Labour, deal or no deal.'"
If the SNP votes down a Labour government, does it necessarily mean that there will be a Tory government? If The Tories can form a government they will do, the Labour / SNP relationship becomes irrelevant. If the Tories can't form a government then they can't form a government.
The most likely scenario, if the polls are correct, is that Cameron will follow the precedents set by Heath and Brown and hang about in Downing Street, trying to form a government. Eventually he will fail and resign. Milliband then becomes PM.
If the SNP votes down the Labour government, it doesn't let the Tories in. Because they can't form a government.
Eventually, if neither Labour or the Tories can form a government, there would have to be a second election. Labour and the Tories would have to agree to support a motion for an early election. The SNP wouldnt have let in the Tories. They would fight that election on the basis that it been caused by the Westminster parties blatant disregard of the voice of Scotland. Another step towards a second referendum.
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| The big day has arrived.
Don't think I've ever been as uninterested in a GE campaigh as this one.
In fact I've gone as far as to purposefully avoid it as much as has been possible...
Just looked this morning online at the six candidates in my constituencey.
The usual three jokers from the main parties who have convinced the great British public that austerity is their fault.
The Little Englander UKIPer (village greens, church bells and no swarthy types hiding behind the cemetary headstones).
Greens (go on, you know it'll make you feel all cuddlier inside).
Yorkshire First (who I couldn't be d to read about but assume he's a miniature version of a UKIPer).
I doubt I'll be rushing to my designated polling station anytime soon.
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973_1515165968.gif Last edited by Ferocious Aardvark on stardate Jun 26, 3013 11:27 am, edited 48,562,867,458,300,023 times in total:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_973.gif |
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Brenda may be appointing a new govt soon, but not much changes, I was delighted to read that I am paying for police officers to leaflet the village where William and Kate live warning everyone off harassing by photography. A heartwarming use of public money and police time I think, but would have been good if they could have dropped off a menu from the local Indian at the same time for free.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-32609527
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Brenda may be appointing a new govt soon, but not much changes, I was delighted to read that I am paying for police officers to leaflet the village where William and Kate live warning everyone off harassing by photography. A heartwarming use of public money and police time I think, but would have been good if they could have dropped off a menu from the local Indian at the same time for free.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-32609527
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Rank | Posts | Team |
Moderator | 14395 | No Team Selected |
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Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
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26.jpg Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20
Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18:26.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: Cibaman "If the SNP votes down a Labour government, does it necessarily mean that there will be a Tory government? If The Tories can form a government they will do, the Labour / SNP relationship becomes irrelevant. If the Tories can't form a government then they can't form a government.
The most likely scenario, if the polls are correct, is that Cameron will follow the precedents set by Heath and Brown and hang about in Downing Street, trying to form a government. Eventually he will fail and resign. Milliband then becomes PM.
If the SNP votes down the Labour government, it doesn't let the Tories in. Because they can't form a government.
Eventually, if neither Labour or the Tories can form a government, there would have to be a second election. Labour and the Tories would have to agree to support a motion for an early election. The SNP wouldnt have let in the Tories. They would fight that election on the basis that it been caused by the Westminster parties blatant disregard of the voice of Scotland. Another step towards a second referendum.'"
It's not just about voting Labour down but offering to support a Tory govt. One of the things I have seen suggested elsewhere is the SNP do a deal with the Tories who deliver devomax to the SNP in exchange for support in passing William Hague's "EVEL" legislation. The logic being devmax is what they always wanted and the Tories have long since given up on Scotland or the concept of the United Kingdom and just want to "rule" England.
I think it is a bit fanciful to say the least and if they did then I reckon the SNP would revive other parties fortunes north of the border as quickly as support for Labour dropped away after the referendum and with 2016 looming they won't do it.
As to the simpler situation of a Labour Queens speech being rejected the SNP would possibly have to vote against to ensure it was, not just abstain. Another election occurs and if the Tories won outright then I am sure Labour and others would argue a vote for the SNP was a vote for the Tories as they suggest voting for the Lib Dem's is.
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50733_1530270912.jpg [color=#000000:ogl9gbum]"Back home we got a taxidermy man. He gonna have a heart attack when he see what I brung him."[/color:ogl9gbum]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_50733.jpg |
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| Quote: Ferocious Aardvark "Brenda may be appointing a new govt soon, but not much changes, I was delighted to read that I am paying for police officers to leaflet the village where William and Kate live warning everyone off harassing by photography. A heartwarming use of public money and police time I think, but would have been good if they could have dropped off a menu from the local Indian at the same time for free.
Quote: Ferocious Aardvark "The majority of the work was paid for by the Royal Family from private funds.'"
I find it funny that the BBC have to say this at the end of the article about the house refurbishment, fully aware of the ridiculousness of the whole folly.
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| Quote: DaveO "It's not just about voting Labour down but offering to support a Tory govt. One of the things I have seen suggested elsewhere is the SNP do a deal with the Tories who deliver devomax to the SNP in exchange for support in passing William Hague's "EVEL" legislation. The logic being devmax is what they always wanted and the Tories have long since given up on Scotland or the concept of the United Kingdom and just want to "rule" England.
I think it is a bit fanciful to say the least and if they did then I reckon the SNP would revive other parties fortunes north of the border as quickly as support for Labour dropped away after the referendum and with 2016 looming they won't do it.
As to the simpler situation of a Labour Queens speech being rejected the SNP would possibly have to vote against to ensure it was, not just abstain. Another election occurs and if the Tories won outright then I am sure Labour and others would argue a vote for the SNP was a vote for the Tories as they suggest voting for the Lib Dem's is.'"
If the SNP voted Labour out, Labour would probably win the election. Refusing to give concessions to the SNP would give them huge kudos in England and they probably couldnt do any worse in Scotland. There certainly wouldnt be any posters of Miliband in Sturgeon or Salmond's pocket.
It doesnt seem that the Scots are as bothered about the prospect of a Tory government as some seem to think. If keeping out the Tories was their be all and end all, they'd all be voting Labour. They must know that voting SNP increases the chances of a Tory government but seem prepared to take the risk. Only a quarter of them are likely to vote for the option that is most likely to keep out the Tories. It seems to me that if the SNP get the seats that are being predicted they will have a strong mandate to stir the pot at Westminister, even at the risk of a Tory government.
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663_1379281559.jpg [b:1g6itio7][color=#000000:1g6itio7]Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth.
Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with imaginings.
Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself.; [/color:1g6itio7][/b:1g6itio7]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_663.jpg |
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| The SNP are ina win win situation, Tories win and they can claim that the Tories do not represent anyone in Scotland with some authority and would bring separation quicker. A Labour win could help them gain a foothold of power to push on for separation in the future, I as a socialist have no problem with it. They have similar policies to Labour, in fact many of us feel that the SNP influence could give us a proper socialist party of the left back.
I am busy with the election at the moment, just stopping for some food before doing some active knocking up of support. All I can say at the moment is the Labour vote is not only holding up its high, very high and the good weather is helping.
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Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 37704 | No Team Selected |
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May 2002 | 23 years | |
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2051.jpg The older I get, the better I was
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg |
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| Quote: DaveO "
As to the simpler situation of a Labour Queens speech being rejected the SNP would possibly have to vote against to ensure it was, not just abstain. Another election occurs and if the Tories won outright then I am sure Labour and others would argue a vote for the SNP was a vote for the Tories as they suggest voting for the Lib Dem's is.'"
You're wrong mate.
A Queen's Speech can be voted down without causing anything other than a little embarassment for those proposing it. It WILL NOT trigger another election.
An election could be triggered only by the incumbents losing a confidence vote, so the SNP can stay true to their promise to reject Trident without bringing down a Labour minority government.
All this was written into the cabinet book in 2010. Drafted by Gus O'Donnell and approved and signed off by Camoron, Clegg et al
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