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Quote: BobbyD "There's been a steady decline, we now rank 7th on a par with S. Korea, Italy and France. US, China and Japan lead the way. Germany are on 7% of world manufacturing, we're on 3%.

We still make things, lots of things.

Manufacturing output as a % of national output
1970 27%
1980 22%
1990 19%
2000 16%
2010 10%

In 1997 it was 19% by 2010 it was 10%. I think we need to put to bed this myth that the Tories destroyed UK manufacturing.'"


Thats a bit more than a steady decline over 40 years.

I'm well aware that the UK is still manufacturing things, I visit such places every week in my job, but to give you an example I visited a small (25 employees) engineering workshop a few months ago and found the experience so unusual that I mentioned to the owner that it was nice to smell lathe lubricants again, I hadn't realised just how long it had been since I smelled that distinctive smell but thinking about it so much of my time is spent in huge several acre warehouses where they stock cardboard boxes full of stuff that has been imported - the last very large engineering works I was in was British Jeffrey Diamond in Wakefield on the day that the miners strike was called, when the 2pm shift clocked off they were all saying their goodbyes because they knew it was the end of their business, and they were right.

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The older I get, the better I was Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator." cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg



Quote: BobbyD "From Andrew Neil on Twitter

In absolute terms he is correct. As a %age of GDP (how the national debt is usually measured) he is way off the mark

Absolute (£bn)https://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/ukgs_line.php?title

%age of GDP

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To change tack slightly, I got a leaflet through the door yesterday, the first one for the Conservative candidate in our constituency. Apparently they have little hope in our area although for generations until three elections ago they had held it with a massive majority, so I had a read about him to see what he has to say...

He's a former Olympic rower, a team mate of James Cracknell, his wife is an Opera singer, he works for Bloomberg in the City of London and, heres the thing, he lives in London.

He knows about Wakefield, he's heard of Leeds but his family is firmly ensconced in London and I suspect that he sincerely believes that he can live 200 miles away from his constituency and deal with the minutiae of an MP's business with maybe a conference call once a week.

That was when I stopped reading, I think its fair to say that this will not be a Tory seat any time soon, Sir Donald Kaberry will be spinning in his grave.

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The older I get, the better I was Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator." cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg



Another useful graphic.

The last five quarters of the previous Labour administration compared to the last five of this bunch of chancers



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The older I get, the better I was Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator." cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg



Quote: JerryChicken "To change tack slightly, I got a leaflet through the door yesterday, the first one for the Conservative candidate in our constituency. Apparently they have little hope in our area although for generations until three elections ago they had held it with a massive majority, so I had a read about him to see what he has to say...

He's a former Olympic rower, a team mate of James Cracknell, his wife is an Opera singer, he works for Bloomberg in the City of London and, heres the thing, he lives in London.

He knows about Wakefield, he's heard of Leeds but his family is firmly ensconced in London and I suspect that he sincerely believes that he can live 200 miles away from his constituency and deal with the minutiae of an MP's business with maybe a conference call once a week.

That was when I stopped reading, I think its fair to say that this will not be a Tory seat any time soon, Sir Donald Kaberry will be spinning in his grave.'"


Looks like a tory gain from the LimpDems down here for similar reasons. The incumbent is retiring and the LimpDems have replaced him with a jobbing ex-MP who lost his seat in 2010. The tories have gone for a local bloke, well-known in the area and a mile away from their 2010 candidate Annunziata Rees-Mogg. Yes she is the sister of Lord Snooty and Camoron once suggested that she may like to dumb down her name to Nancy Mogg, hoping to better appeal to the plebs. That's a PR guy for ya

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regards and ENJOY your sport Leaguefan "The Public wants what the Public gets" - Paul Weller:icons077e_files/5885-54zedonite-msnicons.jpg



Quote: BobbyD "Hi, I'll just give you a quick history lesson. In 1997 the Tories got voted out. In 2008/9 we'd had 11/12 years of unbroken Labour rule. So, even with the best will in the world and whatever fantasies inhabit your mind, you can't really pin the Labour depression on the Tories.'"


If you understand how the system works you can, which is also why we have the socially devisive "society" (does society exist?) today, but don't let History and Hypocrisy disuade you from trying to find out why things happened

Quote: BobbyD "Ah, hypocrisy. Well, look no further than Wallace, Balls and Burnham and their minions.'"


Oh please do illuminate me, and many others. I am always willing to learn.

Tories always have and always will play a dysfunctional version of Catchphrase! icon_wink.gif

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Quote: Sal Paradise "The question was what Brown could have done to ease the impact of the banking madness not what the Tories would have done. Given you believe Labour to be so superior to the Tories how come they did nothing? Do you really want the likes of Ed Balls let loose again'"

What question?

What the Tories would have done is relevant when there is an election in which the Tories are trying to claim they are economically more competent than Labour.
They're currently like an on-looker at a fight shouting "hit him! Hit him harder!" Then when the person gets taken to hospital are complaining that he hit him too hard.

I believe Labour did nothing because they were taken in by the claims of the City, the financial sector (both national and international), the media and the centre-right that everything was wonderful and that the only thing holding us back was government interference and regulation. I believe this extended well beyond the financial sector too. I also think the government and the regulatory bodies didn't really have a clue what was going on in the financial sector.

I blame Labour for not regulating the banks (and many other sectors)during their time in office, no-one else. But de-regulation is not a purely Labour issue. The Tories are to blame for their periods in power. And my quotes prove that, even after the crash, they were wanting further de-regulation. To criticise Labour for doing exactly what they wanted is hypocritical in the extreme. That can be added to the Tory claims of Labour over-spending. The spending that the Tories would've matched at the time.

Given you believe the Tories are so superior to Labour, why do you think they would have done anything to stop it? Especially as we know they wouldn't have.

Ed Balls is rubbish, and a weakness to Labour. But he was Education Secretary icon_confused.gif

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Quote: BobbyD "And? It's like the captain of the titanic claiming it wasn't his fault because if the head chef had been driving he'd have hit the iceberg too! Whatever the Tories said is utterly, utterly irrelevant.'"

What the Tories said they would do at the time is irrelevant to Tory criticism of Labour's actions at the time?

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Your job is to say to yourself on a job interview does the hiring manager likes me or not. If you aren't a particular manager's cup of tea, you haven't failed -- you've dodged a bullet.:icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg



Quote: JerryChicken "To change tack slightly, I got a leaflet through the door yesterday, the first one for the Conservative candidate in our constituency. Apparently they have little hope in our area although for generations until three elections ago they had held it with a massive majority, so I had a read about him to see what he has to say...

He's a former Olympic rower, a team mate of James Cracknell, his wife is an Opera singer, he works for Bloomberg in the City of London and, heres the thing, he lives in London.

He knows about Wakefield, he's heard of Leeds but his family is firmly ensconced in London and I suspect that he sincerely believes that he can live 200 miles away from his constituency and deal with the minutiae of an MP's business with maybe a conference call once a week.

That was when I stopped reading, I think its fair to say that this will not be a Tory seat any time soon, Sir Donald Kaberry will be spinning in his grave.'"


Is Mullholland your MP?

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Quote: Sal Paradise "Is Mullholland your MP?'"



Yup.

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Your job is to say to yourself on a job interview does the hiring manager likes me or not. If you aren't a particular manager's cup of tea, you haven't failed -- you've dodged a bullet.:icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg



Quote: Sal Paradise "Is Mullholland your MP?'"

He is really good an example of what an MP should be about - dealing with local issues. Hopefully he will get back in. It would be a travesty if the fool the Tories have put up gets in.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "He is really good an example of what an MP should be about - dealing with local issues. Hopefully he will get back in. It would be a travesty if the fool the Tories have put up gets in.'"


Its fairly obvious that they aren't targeting this constituency seriously in any way shape or form, which is strange because the next constituency along is one of theirs and like Mulholland is held by a popular MP who campaigns regularly on local issues.

Here in our constituency the nearest (and a close threat) to Mulholland is the Labour candidate who in the last month has been caught out twice making unsubstantiated derogatory claims about the sitting MP in his campaign literature and has been forced to print two retractions and apologies.

So more of the same or go with a person unfamiliar with the truth and a little research before going to print ?

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[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/14252202:io879g1y]2005 Challenge Cup[/url:io879g1y] To reconcile respect with practicality, what is the optimum speed for a hearse?:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_7384.png



Is it just me or is this one of the nastiest, most spiteful elections we've had?

I certainly can't remember the likes of the Murdoch mob ganging up on a 17 year-old girl who had the temerity to like Miliband or the vitriolic personal attacks from the Telegraph and other papers on Miliband and Labour generally. I'm sure the left wing press has been as bad, so this isn't a party issue, but unsurprisingly the Mail has scraped the bottom of the barrel with Littlejohn suggesting he'd rather trust Jimmy Savile to babysit his kids than trust Labour.

The Thatcher comment about personal attacks has been very apt this time around. Is it time for the adults to just grow up a bit?

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The older I get, the better I was Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator." cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan:2051.jpg



Quote: Chris28 "Is it just me or is this one of the nastiest, most spiteful elections we've had?

I certainly can't remember the likes of the Murdoch mob ganging up on a 17 year-old girl who had the temerity to like Miliband or the vitriolic personal attacks from the Telegraph and other papers on Miliband and Labour generally. I'm sure the left wing press has been as bad, so this isn't a party issue, but unsurprisingly the Mail has scraped the bottom of the barrel with Littlejohn suggesting he'd rather trust Jimmy Savile to babysit his kids than trust Labour.

The Thatcher comment about personal attacks has been very apt this time around. Is it time for the adults to just grow up a bit?'"


I think it says much about the incumbents, who have been spinning the press and look like the only thing thay've got left is to spend the final days of the election campaign doing nothing more than fearmongering,

and while we're on about the papers, this is what the Scum are now reduced tohttps://pbs.twimg.com/media/CEP3gltWgAAAv05.png:large" >

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Quote: Chris28 "Is it just me or is this one of the nastiest, most spiteful elections we've had?

I certainly can't remember the likes of the Murdoch mob ganging up on a 17 year-old girl who had the temerity to like Miliband or the vitriolic personal attacks from the Telegraph and other papers on Miliband and Labour generally. I'm sure the left wing press has been as bad, so this isn't a party issue, but unsurprisingly the Mail has scraped the bottom of the barrel with Littlejohn suggesting he'd rather trust Jimmy Savile to babysit his kids than trust Labour.

The Thatcher comment about personal attacks has been very apt this time around. Is it time for the adults to just grow up a bit?'"


No you're right, but then again most of what passes for "debate" in the HoC is nasty and spiteful and owes more to an "us and them over there" attitude than a realisation that you are the 650 most important representatives in the UK and on your decisions stand or fall the well being of 65 million people, their livelihoods, health and general well being, this term of parliament and for the next generation going forward - hence my belief that a removal of the whip would promote more discussion and less bawling and name calling, if your party really want to get a bill through then you're going to have to convince 650 representatives and not just waste an hour shouting as loud as you can at the end of someone else's sentence.

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Canterbury
v
Gold Coast
 Thu 20th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
20:00
Salford
v
Huddersfield
 Fri 21st Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
20:00
St.Helens
v
Warrington
20:00
Wakefield
v
Hull FC
 Sat 22nd Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
15:00
Castleford
v
Catalans
17:30
Leeds
v
Wigan
 Sun 23rd Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
15:00
Hull KR
v
Leigh
 Thu 27th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R5
20:00
Castleford
v
Hull FC
 Fri 28th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R5
20:00
Leigh
v
Wakefield
20:00
Warrington
v
Leeds
 Sat 29th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R5
14:30
Wigan
v
Salford
17:30
Catalans
v
St.Helens
 Sun 30th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R5
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Hull KR
 Thu 10th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R6
20:00
Salford
v
Leeds
 Fri 11th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R6
20:00
Hull KR
v
Wigan
20:00
St.Helens
v
Wakefield
 Sat 12th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R6
17:30
Warrington
v
Hull FC
20:00
Castleford
v
Leigh
 Sun 13th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R6
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Catalans
 Thu 17th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R7
20:00
Wakefield
v
Castleford
 Fri 18th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R7
20:00
Hull FC
v
Hull KR
20:00
Wigan
v
St.Helens
20:00
Leeds
v
Huddersfield
 Sat 19th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R7
20:00
Leigh
v
Warrington
20:00
Catalans
v
Salford
 Thu 24th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R8
20:00
Warrington
v
St.Helens
20:00
Leeds
v
Hull KR
 Fri 25th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R8
20:00
Salford
v
Leigh
 Sat 26th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R8
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Castleford
17:30
Catalans
v
Wakefield
 Sun 27th Apr 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R8
15:00
Hull FC
v
Wigan
 Sat 3rd May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R9
15:00
Leigh
v
Catalans
17:15
Hull KR
v
Salford
19:30
St.Helens
v
Leeds
 Sun 4th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R9
13:00
Huddersfield
v
Hull FC
15:15
Wigan
v
Warrington
17:30
Castleford
v
Wakefield
 Thu 15th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
20:00
St.Helens
v
Catalans
 Fri 16th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
20:00
Leeds
v
Hull FC
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Sat 17th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
15:00
Hull KR
v
Huddersfield
 Sun 18th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R10
15:00
Wakefield
v
Warrington
17:30
Castleford
v
Salford
 Thu 22nd May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
20:00
Leigh
v
Hull FC
 Fri 23rd May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
20:00
Huddersfield
v
St.Helens
20:00
Warrington
v
Hull KR
 Sat 24th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
14:30
Castleford
v
Leeds
17:30
Catalans
v
Wigan
 Sun 25th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R11
15:00
Wakefield
v
Salford
 Thu 29th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
20:00
Huddersfield
v
Leigh
 Fri 30th May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
20:00
Hull KR
v
St.Helens
20:00
Salford
v
Wigan
 Sat 31st May 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
14:30
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sun 1st Jun 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R12
15:00
Warrington
v
Castleford
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull KR
Sat 8th Mar
SL
17:30
Catalans-Leeds
Sun 9th Mar
SL
17:30
Warrington-Wakefield
SL
17:30
Wigan-Huddersfield
Thu 20th Mar
SL
20:00
Salford-Huddersfield
Fri 21st Mar
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
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