FORUMS > The Sin Bin > Scottish Referendum |
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| It seems the Better Together campaign have now attempted to use the Royal Mail as another scare tactic.
An 'expert' has suggested there will be a substantial increase in postage costs post any Yes vote. No Royal Mail financial figures were used in the calculations, with the Royal Mail stating that they were not going to become involved & that the decision was entirely for the Scottish people.
Brown & Miliband may be able to get the core Labour vote out, but will the more intelligent Scots really put up with being insulted?
Those that have already cast their postal vote must be glad they can ignore everythign unti the result is announced.
Will be interesting to see where the No vote will leave the SNP.
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| What is certain is that close to 50% of people who consider themselves Scottish will be unhappy with the result, which in itself isnt healthy
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| Quote: LeagueDweeb "It seems the Better Together campaign have now attempted to use the Royal Mail as another scare tactic.
An 'expert' has suggested there will be a substantial increase in postage costs post any Yes vote. No Royal Mail financial figures were used in the calculations, with the Royal Mail stating that they were not going to become involved & that the decision was entirely for the Scottish people.
Brown & Miliband may be able to get the core Labour vote out, but will the more intelligent Scots really put up with being insulted?
Those that have already cast their postal vote must be glad they can ignore everythign unti the result is announced.
Will be interesting to see where the No vote will leave the SNP.'"
No will leave them pretty much where they've been. Pushing for devo max and planning for the next referendum.
A yes vote is perhaps more interesting. How will they position themselves in the future once independence has been achieved? How will they differentiate themselves from Scottish Labour?
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| Quote: Cibaman "No will leave them pretty much where they've been. Pushing for devo max and planning for the next referendum.
A yes vote is perhaps more interesting. How will they position themselves in the future once independence has been achieved? How will they differentiate themselves from Scottish Labour?'"
A yes vote will expose them as just another political party with little realistic ability to change the status quo - Salmond just sails along at present, promising some bright new world for the Scottish people, when, in reality, little will change for the vast majority of the population. Mundane life will just continue for most and at political level, life will just become a bit more complicated.
Their campaign has reminded me massively of Tony Blair's and New Labour's in 1997 - After 18 years of Tory rule, which had eventually turned stale, the UK population were promised huge change, and with Blair at the helm, who had an undeniably fresh-faced charisma, huge numbers of previously cynical voters were swept along on the euphoria of it all.... Once elected, while they tried their best to bring change, things never really altered for the normal, working-class British person.
The same thing is happening now - Salmond is promising to save Scots from the staleness of British rule.... Once independent, nothing will change but for having nobody to blame for their problems but themselves.
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| Quote: Cibaman "No will leave them pretty much where they've been. Pushing for devo max and planning for the next referendum.
A yes vote is perhaps more interesting. How will they position themselves in the future once independence has been achieved? How will they differentiate themselves from Scottish Labour?'"
A no vote is pretty much a vote of no confidence in the SNP & a vote of no confidence in Scotland itself.
A Yes vote will mean the Scots have confidence in themselves, and thought the SNP will have delivered the referendum & will hold support off the back of it, it will give Scottish Labour a chance to reinvent itself & challenge in the next election.
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| Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "A yes vote will expose them as just another political party with little realistic ability to change the status quo - Salmond just sails along at present, promising some bright new world for the Scottish people, when, in reality, little will change for the vast majority of the population. Mundane life will just continue for most and at political level, life will just become a bit more complicated.
Their campaign has reminded me massively of Tony Blair's and New Labour's in 1997 - After 18 years of Tory rule, which had eventually turned stale, the UK population were promised huge change, and with Blair at the helm, who had an undeniably fresh-faced charisma, huge numbers of previously cynical voters were swept along on the euphoria of it all.... Once elected, while they tried their best to bring change, things never really altered for the normal, working-class British person.
The same thing is happening now - Salmond is promising to save Scots from the staleness of British rule.... Once independent, nothing will change but for having nobody to blame for their problems but themselves.'"
A Yes vote will change the status quo. Self determination is not the status quo for Scots.
It will also change England as the Lothian question will have to be answered, thereby removing 59 MP's from Westminster &/or requring the formation of an English Parliament.
Blair didn't re-engage voters. The 1997 turnout was lower than any other election since 1945 and the 2001 election turnout dropped by 12%. he certainly got the dormant Labour vote out, but nothing beyond that.
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| Quote: LeagueDweeb "
Blair didn't re-engage voters. The 1997 turnout was lower than any other election since 1945 and the 2001 election turnout dropped by 12%. he certainly got the dormant Labour vote out, but nothing beyond that.'"
Maybe, but Blair was undoubtedly the Great White Hope of British politics at the time. He even managed to get a previously anti-Labour Sun newspaper to switch sides - Unfortunately, he was a bit of a anti-climax.... Salmond will go the same way, because, like most 'opposition' parties do, all he has had to do is make empty promises. Once left with the keys to power, most of these 'charismatic' leaders are usually exposed as chancers - Salmond will be no different.
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| Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "Maybe, but Blair was undoubtedly the Great White Hope of British politics at the time. He even managed to get a previously anti-Labour Sun newspaper to switch sides - Unfortunately, he was a bit of a anti-climax.... Salmond will go the same way, because, like most 'opposition' parties do, all he has had to do is make empty promises. Once left with the keys to power, most of these 'charismatic' leaders are usually exposed as chancers - Salmond will be no different.'"
problem is, Scotland may well be left in a very difficult position.
It's like leaving a packed nightclub with a queue outside, once you're out, you're out!
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| Quote: Cibaman "A yes vote is perhaps more interesting. How will they position themselves in the future once independence has been achieved? How will they differentiate themselves from Scottish Labour?'"
The SNP used to be known as the Tartan Tories. The demographic of your SNP member back in the day was very similar to that of a centre-right voter.
Given the SNP white paper is a mish-mash of both left and right policies such as a Nationalised health service yet cutting corporation tax I don't think they know themselves if they are left or right despite the fact they are pitching this as an anti-Tory vote
My view is that down the line many Scots on the left will be disappointed when reality hits.
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| Even if independence turns out to be hugely successful, the benefits will not really be proven for several years. Independence isn't a quick fix. In the short term there will be more losers than winners as the economy adjusts to independence. And losers make more noise than winners. The SNP may enjoy a honeymoon period after independence but the subsequent election will be very difficult for them, particularly if they don't have much of an identity other than as nationalists
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| Quote: LeagueDweeb "It seems the Better Together campaign have now attempted to use the Royal Mail as another scare tactic.
An 'expert' has suggested there will be a substantial increase in postage costs post any Yes vote. No Royal Mail financial figures were used in the calculations, with the Royal Mail stating that they were not going to become involved & that the decision was entirely for the Scottish people.
'"
The now majority-privatised Royal Mail has made no secret of the extra expense it incurs delivering and collecting mail from the highlands & islands, so they would simply apply the same rates as they charge for delivery to any other non-UK country in Europe. I'd fully expect any independent courier to reach the same conclusion.
That's not pressure from the No Campaign, it's simply the free market recognising an opportunity
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| Quote: cod'ead "The now majority-privatised Royal Mail has made no secret of the extra expense it incurs delivering and collecting mail from the highlands & islands, so they would simply apply the same rates as they charge for delivery to any other non-UK country in Europe. I'd fully expect any independent courier to reach the same conclusion.
That's not pressure from the No Campaign, it's simply the free market recognising an opportunity'"
Would be a very simple accounting procedure to split the country into two cost centres, Scotland vs The Rest and then apply commercial principles to the Scotland deliveries, and not surprising if they do - if anyone has noticed and compared, this years small parcel rates are at least 50% higher than last years since the small parcel definitions were re-graded downwards, an increase that slipped under the compliant press radar (probably didn't go un-noticed but unreported anyway), the private courier service that is Royal Mail now only make headlines when the price of a letter stamp goes up.
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| Quote: cod'ead "The now majority-privatised Royal Mail has made no secret of the extra expense it incurs delivering and collecting mail from the highlands & islands, so they would simply apply the same rates as they charge for delivery to any other non-UK country in Europe. I'd fully expect any independent courier to reach the same conclusion.
That's not pressure from the No Campaign, it's simply the free market recognising an opportunity'"
There's no evidence prices will go up. The claim isn't based on any actual financial details provided by Royal mail. BBC ran the story with a film. If it wasn't to back the No campaign, why even run the story when it's not based on anything but unfounded guesswork?
Some on the Yes side are now using the oil card late in the day, by claiming the MoD & nuclear subs blocked oil exploration in the Firth of Clyde during the 80's.
Darling & the No campaign seem to have adopted a victim mentality with claims of unspecified dirty tricks & internet shenanigans. The positivity 7 momentum certainly appears to be on the Yes side, but I'd still see it as a huge surprise if they won.
Interesting that the Labour & Lib Dem factions of the No coampaign don't want to address the Lothian question & don't want to go down the route of an English Parliament. They prefer the regional devolution model, which serves them in trying to keep the electoral dangers of losing large chunks of MP's in check. Exactly the sort of self preservation by the political class that gave rise to the current situation in Scotland.
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Rank | Posts | Team |
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May 2014 | 11 years | |
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| Quote: Dita's Slot Meter "Maybe, but Blair was undoubtedly the Great White Hope of British politics at the time. He even managed to get a previously anti-Labour Sun newspaper to switch sides - Unfortunately, he was a bit of a anti-climax.... Salmond will go the same way, because, like most 'opposition' parties do, all he has had to do is make empty promises. Once left with the keys to power, most of these 'charismatic' leaders are usually exposed as chancers - Salmond will be no different.'"
Blair was window dressing. Middle class white male to airbrush Foot, Kinnock et al from recent memory. Salmond is already the choice of the Scottish people. They know what they are getting & have a far more informed vote on that basis.
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| Quote: LeagueDweeb "Blair was window dressing. Middle class white male to airbrush Foot, Kinnock et al from recent memory. Salmond is already the choice of the Scottish people. They know what they are getting & have a far more informed vote on that basis.'"
utter bullshine, Salmond is like a line from a Housemartins Song "don't marry her, f'k me"
he will be gone in 6 months, whatever decision is made.
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