FORUMS FORUMS



  
FORUMS > The Sin Bin > Austerity gone too far?
179 posts in 13 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
RankPostsTeam
Moderator14395No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2024May 2022LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED

Moderator


Quote: LeighGionaire "The banks have DOUBLED the money supply in the past ten years and although there has been some inflation (mainly in house prices) the world hasn't collapsed yet. Every day the government borrows more money from banks who create it from nothing and charge interest, how stupid is that when they could just create the money themselves and spend it into the economy?'"


It depends on what you want to do with the money. There is an argument that the money the B of E created to give to the banks via quantitative easing so they had money to lend in an attempt to kick-start the economy would generate more economic activity if it were parachuted into every citizens pocket.

However be that as it may you still seem to be under the impression the government is borrowing at some punitive rate off the banks. They aren't. To borrow they issue bonds as I explained. Printing money is not an alternative to that.

We then have the other aim which is to increase the money supply which is when the B of E employs quantitative easing. That isn't borrowing.

You also seem to be saying the fact money supply increases due to fractional reserve banking can or should be replaced by the B of E printing the cash instead. That would simply devalue the currency even faster than we have seen due to the amount of quantitative easing already occurred and inflation would rocket not just go up as the currency devalued more and more.

Quote: LeighGionaire "Secondly creating new money does not automatically create inflation. If you create new money to pay somebody who's unemployed to make something, he or she is adding real wealth to the new money you created. For example pay a man £300 in new money to make some chairs, every chair he makes is new, real wealth. Printing new money can cause inflation but it isn't a certainty like you seem to think.
'"


Well its not like you think that is for sure. You are on about printing billions with the aim of increasing the money supply without that being backed by any kind of asset value. That is nuts.

When they use QE the B of E uses the money it prints to buy assets off banks. The banks then in theory lend the money on (at low interest rates because you don't do QE when interests rates are not low). This policy may or may not work in its aim but you can't just print money as an alternative way to increase the money supply.

Quote: LeighGionaire "Anyway on another note I read the other day that the Government ran up over a £1000 new debt for every man woman and child in the country over the past 12 months. Anybody who thinks these government debts are repayable are living in cloud cuckoo land IMO.'"


A different issue and so long as the interest on the debt is serviceable that doesn't really matter.

Him
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member14970No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2021Nov 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: LeighGionaire "
Secondly creating new money does not automatically create inflation. If you create new money to pay somebody who's unemployed to make something, he or she is adding real wealth to the new money you created. For example pay a man £300 in new money to make some chairs, every chair he makes is new, real wealth. Printing new money can cause inflation but it isn't a certainty like you seem to think.'"

Yes it does increase inflation. To use your example, that £300 given to the chair maker increases demand in various markets. Say he uses £200 of it to actually make the chairs then that's increases demand for the materials he uses to make the chairs, plus any other costs like electricity etc and he uses £100 to live on whilst he makes the chairs, so that's an increase in demand for food, water etc

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman14845No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2021Jul 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Him "Yes it does increase inflation. To use your example, that £300 given to the chair maker increases demand in various markets. Say he uses £200 of it to actually make the chairs then that's increases demand for the materials he uses to make the chairs, plus any other costs like electricity etc and he uses £100 to live on whilst he makes the chairs, so that's an increase in demand for food, water etc'"


But if there were spare capacity in supply of those things that may be purchased (ie in recessionary times where stimulus were needed) would it create inflation?

Him
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member14970No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2021Nov 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Dally "But if there were spare capacity in supply of those things that may be purchased (ie in recessionary times where stimulus were needed) would it create inflation?'"

Yes. The price would be higher than it would have been. It doesn't mean it's a bad thing to do, the benefits in increased demand, higher employment etc might outweigh the negative of higher inflation.
In a recession (or recession-like conditions) it would make sense for the government to fill some of the demand gap by a combination of higher borrowing and temporarily printing money. (So long as the printing of money is controlled by a body other than the government. Ie the Bank of England)

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman14845No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2021Jul 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Him "Yes. The price would be higher than it would have been. It doesn't mean it's a bad thing to do, the benefits in increased demand, higher employment etc might outweigh the negative of higher inflation.
In a recession (or recession-like conditions) it would make sense for the government to fill some of the demand gap by a combination of higher borrowing and temporarily printing money. (So long as the printing of money is controlled by a body other than the government. Ie the Bank of England)'"


But why would prices increase just because demand increased when there was spare capacity and maybe unsold stocks? It is possible to print money without inflation but the danger comes if the printing goes on too long. and that's something that can only be judged in hindsight.

Him
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member14970No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2021Nov 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Dally "But why would prices increase just because demand increased when there was spare capacity and maybe unsold stocks? It is possible to print money without inflation but the danger comes if the printing goes on too long. and that's something that can only be judged in hindsight.'"

Because if there's spare capacity and unsold stock then companies have to lower their prices to sell that stock, if they don't sell anything they'll go out of business pretty bloody quickly. Prices won't necessarily go up, but will either stay stable or not decrease by as much. So prices and inflation are higher than they would have been, which is an increase.
It is almost impossible to print (and effectively use) money without inflation, but there might be additional deflationary factors that are either stronger or even it out.

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman14845No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2021Jul 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Him "but there might be additional deflationary factors that are either stronger or even it out.'"


Precisely.

Him
RankPostsTeam
International Board Member14970No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2021Nov 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Dally "Precisely.'"

That still doesn't mean that the policy itself isn't inflationary.

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman14845No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2021Jul 2021LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Him "That still doesn't mean that the policy itself isn't inflationary.'"


No one would be doing it if it weren't for fear of deflation.

RankPostsTeam
Moderator36786
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200321 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2024May 2023LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED

Moderator


LeighGionaire: the only person I know who is less economically literate than George Osbourne.

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200223 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2017Jul 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Kosh "LeighGionaire

icon_lol.gif icon_lol.gif icon_lol.gif

I do actually know (not by choice) someone who shares similar ideas with LeighGionaire.

They also believe that 9/11 was caused by the US government.

RankPostsTeam
Club Owner17898
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 200321 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Mar 2020Aug 2019LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Mintball ".'"

Well you could argue that, indirectly, it was...

*hides under tinfoil hat*

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200223 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2017Jul 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Chris28 "Well you could argue that, indirectly, it was...

*hides under tinfoil hat*'"


Yeeees. Indirectly, is the word.

That's not what they're meaning.

I have heard, more than once, the: 'steel doesn't melt at ...' argument. They get laughed at. To their face. And not just by me.

RankPostsTeam
Club Owner17898
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 200321 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Mar 2020Aug 2019LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Mintball "Yeeees. Indirectly, is the word.

That's not what they're meaning.

I have heard, more than once, the
If I ever need a good laugh, I google "9/11 conspiracies"

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman47951No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200223 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2017Jul 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



rlCheck this outrl.

A school is found to have asbestos. Then the HSE changes its mind and says it's safe, even though other independent inspections say there is a problem. And the HSE won't release the report.

That would be one way to save money.

179 posts in 13 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
179 posts in 13 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


11.2626953125:10
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
11m
2025 Recruitment
paulwalker71
205
12m
Salford placed in special measures
poplar cats
111
19m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Hullrealist
4047
20m
Film game
karetaker
5751
28m
Pre Season - 2025
Hullrealist
191
31m
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
50m
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
192
51m
Rumours and signings v9
apollosghost
28901
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40800
Recent
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
30s
2025 Recruitment
paulwalker71
205
1m
Film game
karetaker
5751
2m
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
2m
IMG Score
Bull Mania
83
3m
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
3m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63266
3m
Salford
Wires71
53
4m
Fixtures 2025
paulwalker71
8
6m
Castleford sack Lingard
Another Cas
16
7m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2607
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
2025 Fixtures
Jemmo
1
TODAY
2025 Squad
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
SFW
7
TODAY
Fixtures 2025
paulwalker71
8
TODAY
Spirit of the Rhinos
batleyrhino
5
TODAY
Mike Ogunwole
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Bailey Dawson
Wanderer
1
TODAY
2024
REDWHITEANDB
14
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
Shifty Cat
40
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
Bent&Bon
6
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
6
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
Wires71
53
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS