Or reading.

Something he should be able to do well as a result of Thatcher's legacy

And to be honest, there are people on there that "voters" in 2002 had no experience of and they STILL thought some were better than Thatcher

Whoops, a small error.

Doesn't detract from the fact that Thatcher is ranked 16th Best Briton.

Christ. What is wrong with you? You can't possibly be this stupid. They're embarrassing because you bring up "polls", found on Wikipedia, with varying questions, unrepresentative samples and with varying answers as your "evidence" for your assertion. Which has also varied wildly from "best" to "most successful" to "one of the best" to "greatest Briton". None of those polls should be taken seriously by anyone, and you know it, or you should if you passed GCSE maths.

Again, embarrassing, why? Because I have made no assertions, I have merely ridiculed the evidence you have provided following your obviously extensive google search that reached as far as wikipedia, therefore I am not required to provide any evidence. You have made assertions so you are required to and have failed.

I do not look forward to your response, it makes me fear for the Comprehensive system.

Polls are only as good as the data that goes into them - if those answers the questions don't do so truefully then the poll has no validity no matter who is conducting it. I remember the Mori exit poll from the Major election win suggested a significant Labour majority!!

You haven't provided any evidence because you simply haven't got any.

It's embarrassing to try and discredit 9 different polls from various sources simply because you don't agree with them and whilst offering nothing yourself.

Now you try to question my education, probably becuse your intentions are to 1) no longer debate the substantive issues because you have been comprehensively out thought at every turn and 2) start a slanging match so that they thread gets locked which then removes your obligation to introudce any evidence, which I have repeatedly asked for.

Welcome to RLfans

So it really is just entire coincidence that the company with no independent trades unions at all seems to have been the biggest culprit, over a long period of time?



There were negative aspects to trades union culture at the time. There was poor management too. Indeed, poor management seems to be a national problem, in all sectors. Businesses where it didn't seem to occur to owners that new plant might be worth investing in (we had this mentioned only recently here, in terms of the textile mills – still using machinery from the beginning of the 20th century in the late 1970s). It happened in car production and was a considerable shock to the Germans when they took over production of the mini, in an era well after privatisation and the attacks on the unions. No investment, no new training – nothing.

I've seen it myself on countless occasions in small, private businessesBible[/i was the prime example used). It was, however, much more to do with encouraging a vastly increased consumer culture. You needed cheap and far more readily available credit to fuel that – done. You needed to encourage people to be 'aspirational' (translationThe Spirit Level[/i).

Let us be quite clear: either Thatcher and her government, in making the decisions that they did, to start the process that they did, did not realise what the consequences of those decisions would be on ordinary human beings – or if they did, they did not care. Given "unemployment is a price worth paying", I am minded to the latter. Which begs the question of precisely whom government is elected to serve. Because increasingly, these days, it seems to be big business alone.

You have been given the evidence of successive elections, which were the biggest polls ever taken on the issue.

On the legacy ...

Since you mention 'answering questions', let's try this one for (IIRC) the third time of asking: do you consider the current financial crisis to be a good thing – ergo, the policies that led to it have served us well?

Minty 2 AJW71 0. FT

Many thanks.

I should have also mentioned (once again) the example of the Vauxhall plant at Ellesmere Port, which was nearly closed a few months ago.

Why was it nearly closed?

Because we have deregulated to such a degree that the UK is now the easiest country in Europe in which to close an entire factory and sack thousands of employees. In the end, negotiations with the unions saved the plant – and the jobs.

The idea that further deregulation of employment is required to better the economy is utterly ridiculous, and is a cover for those who wish to drive down pay and conditions, and keep the employees nice and scared.

Which nation is the biggest manufacturer and exporter in the EU?
The same one that got to that position by their Unions and Management having constructive relationships.
Viz : Germany.

Yes, the same Germany with all its employment regulation.