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[b:34xc0vwf]Doubt everything, even this[/b:34xc0vwf]:1357.jpg |
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Letting nutters from the Occupy movement take over CiF is probably one of the silliest things the Grauniad has ever done. The fact that the Gruadian chose to do it does not mean that 'mainstream media' have suddenly become converted to their idiot ideas.
There's a good repost to the whole nonsense rlhererl
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There is some very confused thinking on here. People bemoan the fact that we got into a mess due to credit being freely available and most policy suggestions involve growth via further deabt but at the same time bemoan the fact that mortgages for first time buyers are not given away!
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[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/14252202:io879g1y]2005 Challenge Cup[/url:io879g1y]
To reconcile respect with practicality, what is the optimum speed for a hearse?:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_7384.png |
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| Quote: Dally "There is some very confused thinking on here. People bemoan the fact that we got into a mess due to credit being freely available and most policy suggestions involve growth via further deabt but at the same time bemoan the fact that mortgages for first time buyers are not given away!'"
But we appear to have gone from a situation where money was being thrown around, to one where it's kept under lock and key and nobody can have any. I guess banks have never heard of a happy medium? | | |
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| Quote: Chris28 "But we appear to have gone from a situation where money was being thrown around, to one where it's kept under lock and key and nobody can have any. I guess banks have never heard of a happy medium?'"
They have no choice. Things went wrong now they need fixing. If we take, say, a 25 year period - previous 15 years and next 10 you will probably see there was a happy medium on average - just dramatically skewed between the first and second half of that period. | | | |
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[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-league/14252202:io879g1y]2005 Challenge Cup[/url:io879g1y]
To reconcile respect with practicality, what is the optimum speed for a hearse?:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_7384.png |
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| Quote: Dally "They have no choice. Things went wrong now they need fixing. If we take, say, a 25 year period - previous 15 years and next 10 you will probably see there was a happy medium on average - just dramatically skewed between the first and second half of that period.'"
That average will really help businesses who are struggling to get finance to expand and boost growth. ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/11 ... /#comments |
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Quote: tb "Letting nutters from the Occupy movement take over CiF is probably one of the silliest things the Grauniad has ever done. The fact that the Gruadian chose to do it does not mean that 'mainstream media' have suddenly become converted to their idiot ideas.
There's a good repost to the whole nonsense rlhererl'"
The link you provided doesn't mention the article I linked so how can it be a 'repost to the whole nonsense'?
Now here is a link that discusses the issues addressed in the Guardian article, it's from the Financial Times. However they don't slate the Guardian article for being wrong about money creation, they instead lampoon the author for only just finding out how the system works!
Quote: tb "Congratulations to Ben Dyson, self-professed “money and banking specialist” for finally discovering, err, money. Or, how money works.
In a column in the Guardian on Tuesday, Dyson recounts in grand revelatory style how the solution to the system’s current ails is nothing other than recognition of the fact that “money has been privatised”. Shock, horror!'"
ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2011/11 ... /#comments | |
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"If the American people knew tonight, exactly how the monetary and banking system worked, there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
-Abraham Lincoln:995.gif |
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[i:10za56ci]Hold on to me baby, his bony hands will do you no harm
It said in the cards, we lost our souls to the Nameless One[/i:10za56ci]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6505.jpg |
Moderator
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| Quote: LeighGionaire "Now here is a link that discusses the issues addressed in the Guardian article, it's from the Financial Times. However they don't slate the Guardian article for being wrong about money creation, they instead lampoon the author for only just finding out how the system works!
Oh dear. You've misunderstood the article you link to above.
Here - a simple explanation of why Dyson's article was 'bollox on stilts' lifted from the comments section...
Quote: LeighGionaire "No. No, no no no no, with cherries on top. This is the worst (mis)explanation of fractional reserve banking I have ever read.
When you borrow money from the bank, that money is not "created" by the bank. The bank has to fund it - either from deposits (the "prudent grandmother's life savings"icon_wink.gif or from borrowing it from someone else (the wholesale funding market).
The "creation of money" that everyone goes on about is quite different, very simple, and not at all sinister. It results from the fact that when a bank takes a deposit and lends it out again, both the depositor and the borrower treat themselves as having the money in question. Of course that's not actually true - the depositor does not have any money, just a debt owed to him or her by the bank - but because bank deposits are treated as equivalent to cash by almost everyone, the illusion is convincing.
Even then the banks cannot "create" an infinite amount of money, because the government does not allow them to lend out ever penny they receive in deposits. They have to keep a set percentage as reserves.
So for example, thrifty grandma Mrs Bloggs saves GBP100,000 with Megabank. The bank has to keep (say) 8% of this as reserves, but can lend out GBP92,000 to Mr Flatbuyer. Now Mr Flatbuyer thinks he has GBP92,000 and Mrs Bloggs thinks she has GBP100,000, so the total amount of money in the economy appears to have gone up by GBP192,000. But of course it hasn't really. You can see that because eventually Mr Flatbuyer has to pay back his GBP92K and Mrs Bloggs withdraws her GBP100K, which leaves you back to where you began (give or take a little interest). Further because the capital ratio is always positive, the total amount of money that can be "created" in this way is limited. For example, instead of buying a house Mr Flatbuyer could deposite his GBP92K back into a bank, which could then lend out 92% of that (GBP84,640), and so one. Which (for an 8% capital ratio) works out at a maximum of GBP4 being "created" for each GBP1 of "real" money.
How you gonna change the world if you don't understand it?'"
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"If the American people knew tonight, exactly how the monetary and banking system worked, there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
-Abraham Lincoln:995.gif |
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Kosh - the Financial Times could have ripped the Guardian article to pieces if the overall premise about how banks create money had been wrong. The fact that it doesn't and instead focuses on defending debt speaks volumes to me. Notice how you have to find a random reply in the comments section to try and debunk my reasoning. Three people have attacked my reasoning on this thread so far yet none have explained how the Martin Wolf quote mentioned a few posts up is wrong.
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995.gif
"If the American people knew tonight, exactly how the monetary and banking system worked, there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
-Abraham Lincoln:995.gif |
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Why do banks make so much money?
No direct YouTube links please
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