Yeah, let's "toughen up" and show them how tough we are. That will definitely stop people who literally want to die, kill as many people as possible and be remembered in the worst possible way.

As per usual you just assume someone means let's bomb them/kill them. Being tougher on KNOWN extremists living in Britain doesn't mean murder or bombing.

What do people think this "lets carry on as normal" response is actually going to achieve? You think ISIS might eventually get bored and leave us alone?

Well said and a common sense response but that won't stop the apologist group on here shooting you down.

I'm just continually flabbergasted that some people are always more interested in pointing the finger at politicians and certain sections of the British public for what happened rather than the people who actually commit the crimes. How very British PC to shift the blame onto ourselves.

Are you an actual caricature - or do people really believe this stuff when they say it?

If you believe that terrorism is mindless and doesn't have some propaganda element, then you're dafter than you sound; the whole methodology is even named to help you - TERRORism; it's designed to spread fear and to generate a disproportionate response from the authorities - so that our freedoms and lifestyle are curtailed, so we turn against the people who live among us, and we become suspicious, divided and hateful - all of which is happening. So whilst you might sneer and condescend at ordinary people's response to attacks - I guess unless you're Batman or an armed police officer, it's just about all you can do, yes?

I shan't even respond to a question about a member of my family being killed - that's a new low.

Again you're someone who by the comment of "turning against those who live amongst us" make me or others out to be someone whose after each and every Muslim when that's simply not true, we're on about KNOWN muslims with extremists views. We should be able to be tougher on that section of the Muslim community without being knee jerkingly, stereotypically accused of wanting rid of all Muslims.

And my kind of response isn't out "terror" or "hate", Its out of compassion that I simply don't want to see innocent people killed. For me it's more important that parents don't have to bury their 8 year old daughter, that children don't lose a parent, that husbands don't lose wives etc. That's more important to me than the risk of offending people who will have attracted government/police attention for a reason. That's not a crime but people like yourself choose to paint me as a hate filled vengence seeking racist.

And the comment about if you lost a loved one I find extremely relevant because it's fine for people to say "let's carry on as normal"......to be fair imo that's quite a slap in the face of those that have lost someone who simply won't be able to "carry on as normal". So again, you or anyone else, you put yourself in the position of one of those families currently mourning the lost of a loved one and still hear the words "carry on as normal" and treat them the same.

So you carry on dismissing people as hateful racists just because they don't want to see more children hit with nail bombs.

Other than the emotive rubbish you write

I would be really interested in your definitions of known terrirists particularly as some of those involved in recent attacks were off the radar and not known as extremists.

Some were not but due to a lack of resources we could not keep an eye on them.
Maybe cuts to public services and the police contribute to this.

Is it comeone who travelled to syria and Iraq and Libya after we bombed them back to the Stone Age and left them as havens and training grounds for terrorists ? (9maybe we should stop intervening in these countries !!)

Is it someone who campaigns against western intervention in the Middle East ?


Is it someone who organises medical aid for Palestinians ?


Is it someone who prays 5 times a day and wears a beard ?


After we have identified the known extremists what do we do with them.?

Intern them ? That went well in Northern Ireland .

Assassinate them ?

Deport `them back to their own countries like err Britain ?

Prevention orders. Where there re not the resources to police them? Do it without any judicial oversights to stop them using justice as. Way of escaping the long TM of the law.

Ban them from observing some of their backward beliefs. . Maybe ban the veil it sounds catchy but is unlikely to do much to engender any security..

Maybe we could get them all to wear a big yellow crescent badge ?

Would love to hear your ideas ?

I am not averse to looking at ways of addressing the issues but your knee jerk reactions like UKIPS are catchy pick up in ange'r and frustration but they will only make things worse.

Doing the right thing is more important than doing something.

Other than the emotive rubbish you write

I would be really interested in your definitions of known terrirists particularly as some of those involved in recent attacks were off the radar and not known as extremists.

Some were not but due to a lack of resources we could not keep an eye on them.
Maybe cuts to public services and the police contribute to this.

Is it comeone who travelled to syria and Iraq and Libya after we bombed them back to the Stone Age and left them as havens and training grounds for terrorists ? (9maybe we should stop intervening in these countries !!)

Is it someone who campaigns against western intervention in the Middle East ?


Is it someone who organises medical aid for Palestinians ?


Is it someone who prays 5 times a day and wears a beard ?


After we have identified the known extremists what do we do with them.?

Intern them ? That went well in Northern Ireland .

Assassinate them ?

Deport `them back to their own countries like err Britain ?

Prevention orders. Where there re not the resources to police them? Do it without any judicial oversights to stop them using justice as. Way of escaping the long TM of the law.

Ban them from observing some of their backward beliefs. . Maybe ban the veil it sounds catchy but is unlikely to do much to engender any security..

Maybe we could get them all to wear a big yellow crescent badge ?

Would love to hear your ideas ?

I am not averse to looking at ways of addressing the issues but your knee jerk reactions like UKIPS are catchy pick up in ange'r and frustration but they will only make things worse.

Doing the right thing is more important than doing something.

What is the right thing then??? Like I asked earlier but no answer, do we think the "carry on as normal" will make the bad guys get fed up and go away? People that naive?

And this knee jerk claim btw, me and most who are saying the same thing would've said this 12 months ago so you can stop dismissing it as people who are just too emotive at the moment, yet again another weak attempt to downplay the views of others.....'has to be emotive, has to racist etc'.

As others have mentioned in previous pages I don't have the exact answers to how we toughen up....but on the flip side the "carry on as normal" group can't tell me how that's going to stop children getting nail bombed.

Again you dismiss cracking down on known exterminate as simply the individuals who commuted these crimes......this goes higher than them towards the guys who radicalise them but are too cowardly to strap a bomb to themselves. Do you honestly think we're are tough enough on the numerous hate preachers in this country?

Well like Corbin says one of the key issues we need to address is Saudi Arabia.

You will remember tem they are the ones who bombed te Twin Towers in New York.

They are the ones we arm continually and buy oil from.

They are the ones who who run the madrasahs who promote radical Sunni Islam. They are the ones who are funding the fight against Assad.


They are the ones who fund the Sunni muslims and the preachers who promote the radical Islamic view.

Nice to know that you fully support Jeremy Corbin. Who has made this very point that we need to re evalulate our relationship with Saudi Arabia and have a discussion with them about what they do.

Maybe we could stop selling them jets and bombs that they drop on Houthi rebels in Yemen.


Do you trust Theresa May to stand up to the Saudis ?

Again you seem to not understand that suggesting we think about what we are doing that this means not cracking down.

There are many things that could be done.

Deal with the causes of some of the sympathy that people have for these extremists.

Stop getting rid of dictators we don't like but supporting ones that we do.

Stop invading countries and creating political vacuums in which they can survive and thrive.

Stop saying we re going to promote peace and democracy and equality in te Middle East but then ignore the war inequality and lack of democracy in Saudi Arabia, Yemen or Palestine.

Bring in control orders and prosecutions of Islamic extremists with JUDICiAL oversight.


Get more police on the streets.

Increase the number of security personnel needed to keep n eye on the potential terrirists.

Both the attackers in London nd Manchester were all reported to the Police and security Services on a number of occasions by members of the MUSLIM community.


What you do not do is increase the alienation anger and feelings of hypocrisy and discrimination which lead many people to sympathise with some of he aims of the extremists.

Quote: PrinterThe "Oh is Saudi Arabia the country to blame now because it coincides with attacking Theresa May? Previous years it's been Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq etc......wonder what next years middle eastern country to put in the spotlight will be instead of ignoring the Muslim individuals (note I said individuals before I inevitably get accused of wanting all muslims to die or be deported) in this country who are going untouched because people are so sh*t scared of offending people. And those same people have the cheek to say we shouldn't give into fear...,.these acts are happening because of those peoples fear of offending.'" It is pointless talking to you as you are so angry and frustrated you cannot get past the" we need to do something" mentality. You seem incapable of any sort of rational thought https://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/23/opin ... .html?_r=0 www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 73551.html Do a google search it is as clear as day follows night that Saudis Arabia is promoting salamis mall over the Middle East and in the west. I have been saying this for years so have Many others. May is talking about limiting free speech cracking down on Facebook etc. It is ignoring the big issue about Saudi Arabia. This is a fact.. Regardless of the election and Theresa May. Saudi Arabia is a disgusting state in its attitudes to women gays non muslims etc. Yet we bomb Iraq for the same reasons that we sell bombs and planes to Saudi Arabia. Deal with the cause of the cancer not just the symptoms. Locking up 3000 Muslim extremists in Britain will do nothing to stop those who are recruited in the next generations by the Saudis and their beliefs money and political ambitions in the Middle East.

Quote: PrinterThe "Oh is Saudi Arabia the country to blame now because it coincides with attacking Theresa May? Previous years it's been Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq etc......wonder what next years middle eastern country to put in the spotlight will be instead of ignoring the Muslim individuals (note I said individuals before I inevitably get accused of wanting all muslims to die or be deported) in this country who are going untouched because people are so sh*t scared of offending people. And those same people have the cheek to say we shouldn't give into fear...,.these acts are happening because of those peoples fear of offending.'" It is pointless talking to you as you are so angry and frustrated you cannot get past the" we need to do something" mentality. You seem incapable of any sort of rational thought https://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/23/opin ... .html?_r=0 www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 73551.html Do a google search it is as clear as day follows night that Saudis Arabia is promoting salamis mall over the Middle East and in the west. I have been saying this for years so have Many others. May is talking about limiting free speech cracking down on Facebook etc. It is ignoring the big issue about Saudi Arabia. This is a fact.. Regardless of the election and Theresa May. Saudi Arabia is a disgusting state in its attitudes to women gays non muslims etc. Yet we bomb Iraq for the same reasons that we sell bombs and planes to Saudi Arabia. Deal with the cause of the cancer not just the symptoms. Locking up 3000 Muslim extremists in Britain will do nothing to stop those who are recruited in the next generations by the Saudis and their beliefs money and political ambitions in the Middle East.

Both sides of the debate are correct, but both are also wrong in failing to acknowledge the other side of the debate. We have to accept there is a huge problem within the Islamic community in regards to the Islamist/Wahhabi ideology. Simply saying, it has nothing to do with Islam is very naive. Yes, I'm sure the the majority of Muslims are peaceful people in general, but with 3m Muslims in the UK, even if only 1% subscribe, or sympathise with IS or Wahhabism that's still 30,000 potential extremists. Our security services are stretched to breaking point, it's impossible for them alone to weed out every potential threat. Muslims in this country need to do more to bring these people to the attention of the security services, and to other people in their communities. Islam is in dire need of a reformation, at the very least, because it's clear some of the Islamic scriptures are not compatible with modern civilization. Having said that, it took over 1500 years for Christianity to have it's reformation, and not too long before that there was the Spanish inquisition in Europe. We're about 1450 years into Islam's life, so perhaps what we're seeing now with IS is Islam's own Spanish inquisition. Whatever it is, it needs to end.
On the other side, it's also naive to think that our actions have nothing to do with increasing the threat of terrorism. We've cut police numbers by 20,000, we've not even appointed a counter terrorism co-coordinator. We've sold weapons to Saudi Arabia and allowed them to spread their ideology all over the world. We've essentially chopped up the middle east and propped up countless dictators in the region through selling them weapons and buying their oil. Then when they've decided they don't want to play ball anymore, we bring them down without having any plan to rebuild any type of democracy or infrastructure thus resulting the rise of groups like IS. Also, locking them all up in the same prisons was a huge error. Coalition forces have essentially created a huge global network of extremists by doing so.
I'd also suggest, carrying on as normal is a society is exactly what we should be doing. These people hate our way of life, they hate our democracy, and essentially the worst kind of fascists. Showing them that we won't bend to their barbarism is one of the best weapons we have at our disposal.

It's pointless talking to you because you and others just throw the full of hate and anger card. I'm not at all, but because it's the opposite to your views you feel the need to accuse my views of being attached to strong emotions to hide the fact you can't or don't want to answer the tougher questions raised.

Maybe in your mind we don't have to do anything, maybe you're okay that in a few weeks time more young children may well be nailed bombed and then you can start again pointing the finger at British people and politicians as the ones responsible. Just don't blame the ones responsible or at least find excuses for them like a rapist who blames the provocative way a girl was dressed.