Bren, I know that you like the guy's politics but, it's absolutely clear that HE is not comfortable with remaining in the EU and although he bangs on about workers rights etc, which he is right to want to protect, this is only part of the issue.

Labour seem to be split 70 / 30 in favour of remain, with the Tories maybe 75 /25 in favour of leave but having had a referendum with 52 /48 in favour of leave, Labour were not brave enough or committed enough to fight the last election on a "remain" card and yes, Corbyn has been bloody awful on the subject.
Even with the opportunity to back a second referendum, HE instructed his party to abstain.
He needs to grow a pair and quick.

Corbyn was great on the back benches, able to fight for certain issues that he believed in or, against those that hew didn't but, he's an awful leader and just like May, although he has the badge and the big chair, he is not effectively leading his party.

He is frightened to death of committing himself , just in case there is a general election where he may need to change tack. His is so full of splinters, it's unbelievable and if you need to measure his effectiveness, just have a look at the opinion polls where, despite being fractured and with THE worst prme minister since the war, the Tories are still 6/7 points ahead.

I think it was interesting what Reece Mogg said before the last vote when asked if he would now back the deal, he wouldn't commit until he knew what the DUP were doing. Therefore, if she can somehow get the DUP on board then the ERG just might follow suit. So her deal might just not be dead in the water

I was really disappointed yet again in Labour to see them all sat their abstaining from the Referendum vote. Sitting on the fence AGAIN.

There are no facts in there but one - and the Labour party abstained from the motion because the PV movement itself said it was too soon and tactically, the wrong time. I actually think he's played his hand very well - Labour's position has been clear since conference, and he's stuck to that - in the process, inflicting a series of devastating defeats on the government.

I just can't see this argument that because he's not trying to overturn the result at every twist and turn, it's a failure - because it clearly isn't a failure in the eyes of the Labour voters who also voted leave; and I have less and less sympathy with the argument, largely because of the arrogance and certainty with which many of its advocates have rounded on Corbyn as the 'cause' of Brexit, simply because he isn't willing to alienate the electorate by openly stating that he wants to overturn the result; and why are the Tories - the sole cause and agents of Brexit - getting off scot free? Where are the calls for Mrs May, passionate Remainer, to overturn the result and go immediately to a PV?

It goes back to the earlier point that Brexit does not fall neatly within party lines - and that makes it exceptionally difficult for our party political system to navigate through; which is why Mrs May's refusal to work on building a cross-party consensus instead of doggedly pursuing her own deal, has failed - and why the divisions caused by the campaign and the result are now worse rather than better.

If the D.U.P. decide to U-turn after all their rhetoric about the backstop being a no-no, I wonder what the Tories have offered to sweeten the pill?

There will be a number of the E.R.G. gang who will never vote for the deal, but they could be off-set by the likes of Mann & Hoey. It's going to be tight, like the Benn amendment yesterday.

But even if the deal squeaks through, nobody will be really happy with the outcome.

Brexit summed up - nobody will be happy; and every social, political or economic issue for the next ten years will be attributed to/blamed on Brexit, and the arguments will never end.

Joy.

If may had returned from Brussels with the offer of a gold bar for everyone in the uk Labour would have still voted against it.
They just want to vote down any deal in order to instigate chaos and a general election. Saw trickett the Labour MP on tv who certainly is not the sharpest knife in the box. He claims that the only answer to this political log jam is another referendum or a general election. Conveniently overlooking the fact that labour voted against the deal which was put before the house.

Bren, I know that the pollsters do get things wrong but, as I said, he is failing because despite the shambolic ruling party, Labour are STILL 6/7 points behind in the polls, against THE weakest government in over 50 years.

Although I have no time for Mrs May, she is one of the few MP's who voted remain and IS trying to achieve some kind of Brexit, albeit a shizzle deal, that has been handled shockingly from the outset.

She has gone with her own view, rather than take ANY account of the country at large and has done NOTHING to sell any view of life beyond Brexit or, try to build bridges between Leave and Remain and Labour are STILL behind in the polls.

You seem fixated by polls - do you recall where Labour were in the polls before the snap GE, when the Govt's working majority was wiped out, and Labour received it's highest vote share since the 40's?

Polls are now a political weapon - they are used selectively, in a non-partisan way, to *shape* public opinion rather than to reflect it.

Fair enough Bren, although IF Labour were 10 points ahead in the polls, I guarantee that both you and I would be happier ??
Things can of course change during an election campaign but, right now, Corbyn is not cutting it and I repeat, is a closet Eurosceptic.
Ultimately it will be his (political) funeral but, against Mrs May and her party of warring factions, ANY serious opposition party should be well ahead.

You can bang on about Labour till the cows come home, however the Tories plus the D.U.P. have enough M.P.'s to get the deal through.

How about Barclay, he stood at the dispatch box saying a "realistic" extension was in the nations interest, he then voted against the Government motion!

Labour didn't call the referendum, nor the G.E, & is in the minority in the house, all the blame lies totally with the Tories.

What on earth are you talking about, this was not an election and even an election within our so called democracy we cannot have one every couple of years thank god even if we do change our mind.
It was promised as a one off referendum what ever the result, therefore, to go back on that would be undemocratic. Would you be happy for the SDP to keep kicking the can down the road and have referendums every couple of years until they get their way, because I wouldn't. you don't even know who if anyone has changed their mind.

If there was clear indication and I mean a clear indication that the people of this country has dramatically changed its mind then maybe it should be considered, but I have not seen any indications of that.

Absolutely re Labour, they have a totally shambolic Tory govnt, arguably the worst Prime Minister in history and they ARE still behind in the polls, it was comical top see them all sat on their bums and not voting in the new referendum vote. If they want another referendum vote for it, if not then vote against but for god sake have an opinion. Thats what we have had off our main opposition right through this fiasco. I am a Labour voter or should I say was.

I am totally disgusted with this Tory Government, but Labour continue to show how weak they are and I cannot vote for them.

Nope - as I said, polls are not reliable (with one notable exception) and they don't reflect - they direct; so I wouldn't care either way.

Corbyn campaigned for and voted Remain - and I think his position was 'Remain and Reform' - which seems very sensible to me; because if a large section of the electorate are, as they now claim, dissatisfied with the EU (although I didn't see much evidence of that prior to the referendum campaign) the best way to satisfy them was to stay in and retain all the benefits, but work to reform it as a voting member.

He may not be cutting it for you - but Labour remains the single biggest political party in Europe, and under his leadership, it has become financially stable and returned the biggest vote share since 1945; and many of the socialist policies in the manifesto are universally popular, particularly the nationalisation of rail and utility companies - so he's doing something right.

Anywho - it takes all-sorts to make a world - and at least now there's the Funny Tinge party for all the disenfranchised centrists to get behind; who isn't thrilled by the prospect of continuing austerity and the return of national service?

Can someone enlighten me, I have heard all the talk about this deal that May has negotiated and how bad it is for the country, I thought the main issue was the backstop and in effect a border down the Irish Sea, however, I have also heard that it would keep us linked to the EU for ever, which I have never understood why. On todays daily politics it was mentioned again but in the context of the link being in a customs union and a trade policy is that the only reason. Surely not.

I meant your faux hysteria around the end of democracy. You & the rest of the Brexit militia were noticeably silent when May called a general election at extra short notice less than 2 years after the last, in an attempt to stifle democratic debate. But what's this;



I also didn’t notice you on here screaming the end of democracy when May repeatedly takes her Leave strategy to the vote when she has been trounced. The true colours of the Brexiteers are really on show with their threats of civil unrest.