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FORUMS > The Sin Bin > The General Election Thread |
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| Quote: shinymcshine "Seems crazy to focus on TV leaders debate when you can only vote in your local constituancy, and most of the time the candidates there are complete "unknowns".
Getting people interested in voting again needs to build from the bottom up.'"
Agree with this. Its something I've thought for a while as when I first got to vote I found it strange that no-one knew who their own MP was. Some of the "apathy" toward politics is just ignorance or laziness masquerading as apathy on behalf of ignorant or lazy people who can't be d to just watch the news once in a while. During one of the recent by-elections that UKIP won (I think it was Clacton) the media spoke to one old woman who had never heard of UKIP. In the same way as a few years back my mates girlfriend at the time voted BNP because she'd got a leaflet through the door from them and it said all about British jobs etc. She had no idea who they were but voted for them anyway. That has nothing to do with apathy or politicians but is just lazy ignorant people who will spend hours watching complete crap on tv but can't be bothered to just think for a few mins a week about what's going on in the world around them.
However (rant over) there is obviously an issue with local representation. I think it partly stems from that people don't know who is in charge or has responsibility for what and crucially local media is a joke. In the media's relentless drive over the last few decades to centralise and report only London-centric stories its left a huge gaping hole in the knowledge and accountability of local representation.
I think we need a new way of making local officials/councillors etc accountable for what happens in their region. Be that more responsibility for how money is spent in their region or just make it clearer what they can and can't do. Obviously decent local media would help hugely.
With MP's, again the local media would help massively too but I also think we're sort of in a bit of a no-mans land in terms of MP's. I think we probably either need a lot more so that you might have a chance of actually seeing or knowing them. Or fewer so that they get more media attention and more people would know who they are? Only a thought.
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| Quote: Mugwump "Jesus H. Christ! When will people stop thinking the entirety of political thought is represented by this completely bogus "Left" - "Right", "Labour", "Tory" false dichotomy? You'd think after all we've witnessed over the past thirty years with Labour, the Tories and now the Lib-Dems not just ruthlessly carving up the welfare state, the education system, the NHS etc. but also helping to facilitate the biggest tax-haven for corporate wealth (both in the UK and spread across a network of British dominions in the Caribbean as well as the Channel Islands) in existence, the penny would finally drop.
As long as people continue to believe that the limits of their political responsibilities are represented marking an occasional "X" on some polling ballot - the winner of which represents neither "Conservatism" as it was once defined nor "Labour" but instead is really an abstract, ideologically flexible subset of a SINGLE PARTY in Parliament - their impoverishment will carry on unabated.
I mean, seriously - Cameron (I won't say the "Tories" because such policy reforms are radically un-Conservative) has now "leaked" the idea of charging for visits to the doctor's surgery. Are people so DUMB that they think such charges will remain fixed for eternity - rather than being ratcheted up along the lines of prescription charges so that in essence the NHS is no longer free?
And anyone who seriously believes New New Labour is going to come riding in on a white horse to put right everything those Nasty Tories have tampered with in four years needs his head examining.'"
Those could have been my very thoughts, regular readers may recall the phrase "football supporter politics", well its the funneling of thoughts into "left" and "right" that simply maintains the system where any party in government lines its members pockets for the future regardless of rhetoric or pretend political theories - there is no "left" or "right" in the current pair of parties who are the only ones likely to ever hold power and you have to go back forty years to understand what "left" and "right" really means.
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| Quote: Hull White Star "I don't know what your point is about crisis loans is but you know full well there is no crisis loan anymore, that safety net was actually taken away by your beloved Tories and people are having to wait weeks rather than days for the new Budgeting Loan. Whats your feeling about the proposed changes to ESA and Carers Allowance for the sick and disabled? Have we not bore the brunt of the cuts already with the changes to the ILF, ESA and PIP or is it a case of kicking a man whilst he's down?'"
My point about the crisis loans is this as you're clearly incapable of joining the dots, or unwilling.
Your bleating about the 1m+ foodbank use is, in your blinkered eyes, a catastrophe, yet you don't want to think about the almost same number in crisis under your beloved party.
No idea, about the other stuff, you're going to say it's very, very bad based on your own prejudices. You should come up with some figures, ideally from the Guardian or Morning Star to show how terrible the Tories are.
I remember Rachel Reeves saying the Labour party will be tougher on those on welfare than the Tories, so my conscience is clear, I made sure Labour didn't get in to screw the poorest in society. Did you?
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| Quote: JerryChicken "Those could have been my very thoughts, regular readers may recall the phrase "football supporter politics", well its the funneling of thoughts into "left" and "right" that simply maintains the system where any party in government lines its members pockets for the future regardless of rhetoric or pretend political theories - there is no "left" or "right" in the current pair of parties who are the only ones likely to ever hold power and you have to go back forty years to understand what "left" and "right" really means.'"
It's debatable whether ideology was ever as important as we are led to believe. I tend to think people have their own needs and desires which are inflexible. Rather than conforming to the tenets of ideology they'd much rather prefer seeking out an ideology which is sync with their own requirements - or selecting those tenets of an ideology which they like whilst ignoring all others.
A prime example would be those politicians who for years have espoused the virtues of "Free Market" capitalism. What they really mean is free markets are GOOD when the economics suit them. But should some foreign competitor attempt to flood the market with cheap imports and they're screaming for the imposition of trade tariffs like a child who's filled his diapers.
This is the reason I have [isome [/isympathy for the likes of Milton Friedmann. Since I can remember he's been the object of a concerted hate campaign by the anti-globalist brigade. And they do have a point - of sorts. But if these idiots actually bothered to read or listen to Friedmann they'd know he was hopping mad about the mis-application of his economic methodology for DECADES.
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| Quote: BobbyD "My point about the crisis loans is this as you're clearly incapable of joining the dots, or unwilling.
Your bleating about the 1m+ foodbank use is, in your blinkered eyes, a catastrophe, yet you don't want to think about the almost same number in crisis under your beloved party.
No idea, about the other stuff, you're going to say it's very, very bad based on your own prejudices. You should come up with some figures, ideally from the Guardian or Morning Star to show how terrible the Tories are.
I remember Rachel Reeves saying the Labour party will be tougher on those on welfare than the Tories, so my conscience is clear, I made sure Labour didn't get in to screw the poorest in society. Did you?'"
No, not prejudices Bobby, but [iexperience [/i. No one better to be able to give an account of the truth than those who are experiencing what is happening. With what Cameron is going to do with the Disabled, I'd say they were [ialready [/i
screwing the poor in society.
My conscience is very clear because I'm not a turkey that voted for Christmas.
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18919_1341147656.jpg [quote="King Monkey":30st820n]Maybe a spell in prison would do Graham good.
At least he'd lose his virginity.[/quote:30st820n]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_18919.jpg |
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| Quote: Mugwump "
This is the reason I have [isome [/isympathy for the likes of Milton Friedmann. Since I can remember he's been the object of a concerted hate campaign by the anti-globalist brigade. And they do have a point - of sorts. But if these idiots actually bothered to read or listen to Friedmann they'd know he was hopping mad about the mis-application of his economic methodology for DECADES.'"
I agree, and economists like Hyman Minsky, Augusto Graziani, and Steve Keen have seen these flaws, and have been the voice of reason against the Chicago (or neo-classical) school of economic theory for decades, but obviously as their attempts to educate the political and financial powers that be fell on deaf ears. Which is what you would expect when the principles of that economic theory have made those same political and financial powers that be all the more wealthy, and all the more powerful.
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427 |
170 |
257 |
26 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Warrington |
17 |
436 |
231 |
205 |
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St.Helens |
16 |
429 |
170 |
259 |
22 |
Hull KR |
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397 |
217 |
180 |
22 |
Salford |
16 |
317 |
308 |
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22 |
Catalans |
16 |
304 |
234 |
70 |
20 |
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Leeds |
17 |
309 |
316 |
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18 |
Huddersfield |
16 |
298 |
365 |
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12 |
Leigh |
15 |
270 |
250 |
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16 |
246 |
435 |
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16 |
218 |
496 |
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LondonB |
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156 |
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344 |
186 |
158 |
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327 |
269 |
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396 |
283 |
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Doncaster |
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257 |
341 |
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13 |
York |
15 |
339 |
305 |
34 |
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Batley |
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320 |
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284 |
344 |
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393 |
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439 |
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